Obama, McCain tussle on healthcare

Neither McCain or Obama have the real answer. HMOs and private insurance companies make money by denying coverage. Germany and England have proven that universal government health insurance is actually less expensive because there are no sales commissions to pay or advertising to buy like private health insurances companies do. Let's learn a lesson from Germany and England, Scottland, etc. etc. etc.

Basically, McCain is saying that people who are not sick, who have good jobs with health care benefits, are more prudent and therefore deserve to have health insurance. And they should pay for this prudence with higher taxes.

We suspect that McCain himself is one of these prudent people who have provided for their families with health insurance, and of course he won't mind the additional one twentieth of a percent of his $771,000.00 income that will be taxed.

As to those who have lost their jobs and their health insurance, well, the free market will take care of them -- possibly by killing them off.

McCain's health proposal looks like it was written by the insurance industry lobbyists - just like the Medicare Prescription Plan was written by the pharmaceutical industry lobbyists. The fact that McCain's plan does not eliminate the "existing conditions" problem leads me to believe that it will simply be a handout to the insurance companies. There is no value in this plan for the average "Joe 6 Pack"

I want the gov't to stay away from health benefits. I'm happy with the coverage I get from my employer. Individuals should be able to choose if they participate in any program. They can give health care to those without benifits, out of what ever tax pile, just keep your hands of my stack (after taxes), ok?

Did you pick the cheapest doctor? If not you are part of the problem. If price truly drives health care then that would be the fix. England and Germany's healthcare???????..enough said.

As a small business we've looked several times at health care for our employees every year. The truth is that the cost is far higher per family than $5000 and so it begs one to wonder where this number came from.

Anyone who is below 40 years old , does not smoke or drink and is male and cannot therefore give birth will benefit and everyone else will find it harder to get insured. If the republicans think less government is better then how about all the extra people needed to put this plan into place. The feds are the most inefficient thing there is.

It never ceases to amaze me just how expensive health care is

My family's health care plan is completely employer provided. Under McCain's plan we would end up paying a could hundred dollars a month in income tax on our health insurance. We can't afford another couple hundred a month. The credit would not help my family at all (since we don't currently pay for a plan). The only choice that McCain's plan would leave us is to drop our excellent employer provided plan to go shop for some cheap plan with the measly $5000. His plan frightens me!

The US healthcare system is 60% more expensive, per capita, than Switzerland's -and theirs works better. Isn't it common sense to find out why we're paying so much more for so much less?

Republicans who criticize the healthcare systems of other countries, without exception, have never been to those countries, and in actual fact have no idea how those systems work. These uninformed folk just repeat what their party has told them to repeat - zero critical thinking. Ditto heads, in other words.

Health care decisions are already driven by insurance-- my father is dead because he was transferred from the hospital twice before he was ready, not because his insurance was running out, but because those were the dates the hospital would make less money.

Price driving health care doesn't "fix" anything but give more profits to the businesspeople. It doesn't serve patients or doctors. The insurers really don't care about your family.

I agree with Wolfgang. I feel that the evidence is more than obvious in other countries that Single Payer Health Care works. Our current system is inefficient: too much overhead, with administrative and billing costs; not enough preventative care to reduce the much more difficult and expensive treatments which occur later in a person's life; medical care motivated by profit-seeking doctors whom use expensive and unwarranted treatments because based on which HMO plans they know are going to pay out; and I believe there is also something to be said about how health care is delivered -- In its current state it is largely fragmented and un-cohesive which leads to more administrative and paper work. Therefore, neither McCain or Obama have a logical approach to the health care problem. Fortunately, Ralph Nader does propose single-payer health care for all!

Gosh. With a $2500 tax credit, I can 1 or 2 months of health insurance. I can barely wait to get sick then. I hope it's not football season.

Oops. I forgot. The Health Insurance Companies will know that were coming with our tax credits and so they'll up the prices (just like drugs did). I might get a couple of weeks. But there's always the emergency room (as long as I don't live in L.A.).

>just keep your hands of my stack (after taxes), ok?
Spoken like a true compassionate.

McCain continues to follow the principle that the free market market will improve our health care system..When a doctor determines that a course of treatment is not helping the patient and possibly actually hurting them, they will make a change..We have tried free market and the patient(our nation) is not getting better..The insurance companies will not go away..why don't we look at a system simliar to Australia where both the government and insurance companies have a role..we need to get past the decision that universal coverage makes sense then deal with the tough decision of how we as a nation should spend our money...is it education, military or health care?..

Single payer is the only way to go. McCain wants to do to health care what he did to the Oil Industry and Wall Street: deregulate so the fat cats can make more of our hard earned money. Our shrinking pension investments and higher oil prices are a tax the corporations levy on us.

Obama's health plan is garbage. I used to live in a country where helath care was run by the gov't. You literally have to wait in-line for hours to see the a doctor who gives 2 shits about you. The worse part is that It'll cost the tax payer in upward of 70 Billion dollars per year. Yeah that's a great plan...wtf.

Ditto the comment that the US need to look at other countries - Europe, Australia, New Zealand - and see how much better their systems are.

Critics claim that these countries have longer waiting lists etc. That is true to an extent, but remember that their total healthcare expenditure is usually about half the price of the US. If they were to spend as much on health as the US does, their medical care would be much much much better!

Don't forget that McCain (and Obama), with an income that could afford any insurance plan, enjoys health coverage run by the same federal government that he doesn't want you and me to receive.

Why not create a National Health Insurance Plan that can operate at a profit?
National Health Insurance offered to ALL Americans on a sliding scale.
Low-income Americans pay zero premiums or co-pay.
Middle-class pays discounted premium/s or co-pays.
All Americans can choose to opt into Federal Insurance or buy own private insurance.
All doctors/hospitals MUST take Federal insurance plan.
Caps set on reimbursements to doctors/hospitals to prevent exploitation.
Strict auditing procedures to eliminate corruption.

McCain can say what he wants. This is a backdoor tax that will kill off employer paid healthcare programs all over the country. He should be ashamed of trying to perpetrate this bait and switch on the American people

I don't see how the measely $5000 credit will help my family - actually my partner and I can't legally get married, so I guess that would be two $2500 credits. I currently provide my partner with Health Benefits through my employment, but since we can't get married, I'm currently paying taxes on those benefits. To make matters worse, my partner is a type 1 diabetic, so the $2500 credit might cover one month's worth of insurance.

Life would be much simpler if there were a nationalized health care system.

Why would you vote for McCain???
*McCain hurts you on health care. - don't listen to what he says read what he going to do.
* McCain is going to hurt you on social securty. Read!!!
* McCain is against helping children health care- read his vote record
*McCain is against womans rights - read his vote record
*McCain is against the vets care and benifits - read his vote record
*McCain is against ending the war - 10 billion a month
Vote for obama and do your family, our country and the world a favor.

All the people like Wolfgang Nordemyer who think Nationalized medicine is the answer are way un informed about this subject, having lived in England for 27 years it is the worst system by far under funded hospitals, run down facilities, lack of staffing,under paid doctors, thats why they all come from abroad like India Sri Lanka, eastern europe because the British doctors and Nurses all go to Australia, and the US where the pay is much better it does not work in the UK and they only have 60 million people imagine with 300 million what it would be like you all have been to the DMV with all the lines and confusion well imagine that at the hospitals because that is what it is like are the American people so stupid that they would put themselves and their children in the hands of Barny Frank and Charles Schumaccer you have seen what these clowns have done with the mortgage fiasco, dont be a fool and listen to this left wing radical Obama he is a snake oil salesman

To Ken Warner,

Obama's plan wouldn't touch your employer's health plan. His plan is meant to cover those who can't get insurance through work or on their own. The McCain assertion that government will take over all health case is a lie. Read about it yourself if you don't believe me

John McCain's Health Care Plan is a medical deregulation disaster which will happen is he is elected. I am a medical professional and quite familiar with health benefits provided by employer.
My Opposition to McCain Health Care Plan
(1)Gives tax credit of $5000 for a family - but average cost per Kaiser Permanente Health Care quote cost is $12,000 per year. Single person only receives $2500 tax benefit. Family will be taxed health care on their income.
(2)Employer no longer will be able to deduct Health Care for it's employees. No incentive given. Employers stop providing coverage in large numbers.
(

Kamakaze (and others), the Obama-Biden plan is not "government-run." Check your "facts" before you start typing. Obama's plan builds on the existing health care system, and uses existing providers, doctors and plans. Under the current system, which McCain admires so much, my doctor has to "sacrifice a goat" (his words, not mine) to get me a referral to a specialist, even when he believes it is in my best interest. That kind of nonsense will end under the Obama-Biden plan. But the fact that we will no longer have to bow and scrape to the insurance companies does NOT mean the Obama-Biden proposal will be "government-run."

The fundamental problem is that we, as Americans living through the Cold War, have all been indoctrinated as to the evils of "socializing" infrastructures. Meanwhile our military, transportation, education, fire and police, medicare and "SOCIAL" security systems are ALL forms of socialism and none of us would want any of these systems to be disbanded. The contribute greatly to the common good.

Pure capitalism has never and can never work because the best players will always consume all of the benefit, leaving none for the rest. It's a winner take all game. Pure socialism has never and can never work because it doesn't reward exceptionalism. The only practical solution is a hybrid government and this is what we now have. To clarify, we American do not and have never lived in a purely capitalistic society.

The question is "where do we draw the line". Health care, unlike entertainment for example, is necessary. We can not survive without it. Secondly, health care does not lend itself to an free market economy. How many of us will shop around for the best price during a cardiac event. Because of this simple fact, we are subject to gouging. When your house is burning down you don't call 3 or 4 private fire extinguishing companies looking for the best price. You simply call the one socialized entity and the job gets done in a fairly efficient manner. Socialism has its merits when applied correctly.

Regarding the candidates respective plans, McCain's simply throws money at a greedy, failing capitalist infrastructure. Obama's simply unites all Americans under a collective bargaining umbrella which will allow us to negotiate better rates, the same thing that every big company and insurance group already does.

To summarize: Obama smart, McCain idiot.

you kiero k gane obama por k esmejor presidente bueno bye

Oh i see what this page is all about if i dont agree with Mohhamed Obama i dont get posted why dont you just say not for republicans just mindless democrats and dont waste my time you commie

To the guy that says "You literally have to wait in-line for hours to see the a doctor ", well I already do that when I bring my kid in for vaccinations. Or when my wife goes in for a prenatal check up.

Go to wikipedia and look up universal healthcare. You will find that the united states is the only developed wealthy country that doesn't have universal healthcare. It's not just Germany and England. Hundreds of other countries have it and it works for them.

Palin has the nerve to talk about Obama - when she infact is one step away from being a felon. Troopergate, tax evasion, witchcraft. This is the best John McCain could do????

The american health care system is a joke! On the surface it is great, IF YOU HAVE MONEY.

I am Canadian, with several american friends and one of the major differences - according to what you are all told - is that our wait times are bad. They are not, if you have an urgent need; you will get it immediately. It isn't your wallet that creates the urgent need.

Key point:
HMO's answer to investors, so why would you think it is in their best interest to give you excatly what you need if it is too expensive. The HMO in most cases also owns the hospital, so they can dictate such action. That is a MAJOR conflict of interest.
Up here and in all other progressive societies, our system is government run. And guess what if they don't perform then they lose their jobs next election simple as that.

Your healthcare system is run by an INSURANCE COMPANY. They run on coverage, if your coverage doesn't include cancer treatment, then guess what you go to skid row or die. If your coverage doesn't include anesthesia then guess what...suffer. These are all weird examples to use because I HAVE NEVER BEEN REFUSED TREATMENT FOR ANYTHING EVER. Nor anyone else that I know.

It is incredible that the one system that is for the people is not run by the people. You all need to wake up free market NEVER has your best interest in mind. They only need to make more money.

For those that don't agree, explain to me how a for-profit company/hospital can run, pay their doctors millions and still turn a profit without hosing the patients for as much money as possible. Last I heard a triple bypass in california can run up to $900,000, why is that? Why do I even know that figure, I dont care just give it to me if I need it.

Last point
Canada spends 10% of GDP on healtcare all of which is free for everyone
USA spends 15% of GDP on healthcare, but you have to pay, insurance companies must be skimming off the top somehow. Or it must be lobbyist using your money to pay off people like senator McCain to make them richer.
Great system you have.

PS. for all you republicans that try to poke holes in what I am saying .
Canada and the US are completely scaleable, we are excatly 10% of your population, 10% of your GDP, etc. so it is a match. The US can spend less on healthcare, get rid of a very unnecessary industry and give more back to the people.

The american ideal is capitalism, to capitalise is to hold someone down to advance your position.

Obama was 8-9 years old when William Ayres formed the radical Weathermen organization. As Obama rose in Chicago politics, he was selected along with Ayres and Republican members alike to serve on various non-profit boards in Chicago. John McCain was an adult and a US Senator when he voluntarily intervened to assist "his good friend" Charles Keating in the S&L financial scandal. McCain was not "dragged" into the Senate hearings on the S&L crimes because he was a Republican, those are the words of McCain's attorney who is trying to put lipstick on McCain's piggish behavior in an earlier financial crisis.

i WOULD HATE TO SEE US HAVE SOCIALIZED MEDICINE. DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA HOW LONG YOU HAVE TO WAIT FOR AN APPOINTMENT???? YOU COULD DIE IN THE MEANTIME. I'D RATHER PAY MORE AND LIVE!

To Alex

To Ken Warner,

Obama's plan wouldn't touch your employer's health plan. His plan is meant to cover those who can't get insurance through work or on their own. The McCain assertion that government will take over all health case is a lie. Read about it yourself if you don't believe me

I don't believe you and I don't believe that liar Obama. What Obama says he wants to the public and what he ultimately wants are two different monsters.
He wants to add the uninsured, the underinsured and pretty soon employers will find that it is cheaper to jetison health insurance for employees and let the government pay for it.

Nice tactic, nice way to socialize medicine.

McCain's campaign admitted today (10/4) he'd CUT Medicare and Medicaid to pay for his proposal! Of course, they didn't say how he'd gut Medicare, but since he's voted with President Bush 95% of the time, McCain would likely adopt Bush's idea of slashing $65.6 billion in Medicare and $14 billion in Medicaid over the next five years. Look out, hospitals, nursing homes, home health, and rehab services! In the end, it'll be children, the mentally and physically disabled, and older Americans who pay the price for these misguided ideas.

There's a 95% chance that McCain's Medicare cuts would look like President Bush's -- but a 100% chance they would have a devastating impact on the health of older and vulnerable Americans.

If you are self employed you will like the McCain plan. Because you receive no employer contributions McCains plan would add 5000 to help pay for your healthcare. It won't cover the cost since a lot of folks are paying well over 5000 for healthinsurance. But it will help
If you have a good employer plan, you might not be so happy.
1. Your employer could drop your plan
2. You might have a tough time getting good insurance now you are no longer with a group plan.

McCain's campaign admitted today (10/4) he'd CUT Medicare and Medicaid to pay for his proposal! Of course, they didn't say how he'd gut Medicare, but since he's voted with President Bush 95% of the time, McCain would likely adopt Bush's idea of slashing $65.6 billion in Medicare and $14 billion in Medicaid over the next five years. Look out, hospitals, nursing homes, home health, and rehab services! In the end, it'll be children, the mentally and physically disabled, and older Americans who pay the price for these misguided ideas.

There's a 95% chance that McCain's Medicare cuts would look like President Bush's -- but a 100% chance they would have a devastating impact on the health of older and vulnerable Americans.

For all those people who say you don't have to wait in line for healthcare in the US...

Remember back to that time when you wanted to schedule a mamogram. How long was it before you could get an appointment? Around here the wait has been about 6 months for the women I work with.

My roommate needed to get a cyst that was growing on her ovary removed. How long did it take them to get her an appointment (if she didnt go to the ER first) to diagnose it? A month and a half!

Any doctor that is decent around here has long waitlines for appointments. Just because you don't wait in the waiting room doesn't mean you don't wait. The time between when you try to schedule an appointment and you actually get that appointment is waiting in a line. The line isn't physical, but it achieves the same thing.

McCain's campaign admitted today (10/4) he'd CUT Medicare and Medicaid to pay for his proposal! Of course, they didn't say how he'd gut Medicare, but since he's voted with President Bush 95% of the time, McCain would likely adopt Bush's idea of slashing $65.6 billion in Medicare and $14 billion in Medicaid over the next five years. Look out, hospitals, nursing homes, home health, and rehab services! In the end, it'll be children, the mentally and physically disabled, and older Americans who pay the price for these misguided ideas.

There's a 95% chance that McCain's Medicare cuts would look like President Bush's -- but a 100% chance they would have a devastating impact on the health of older and vulnerable Americans.

Do you know someone whose insurance company has turned down a legitimate claim.

If not, you don't know anyone with serious illness.

McCain plan turns over to these very insurance companies your access to health care. The individual tax payer doesn't get the tax credit. It goes directly to the insurance companies.

The plan dismantles state regulations and allows the insurance company to exclude anyone from coverage.

It taxes employer provided insurance benefits because McCain’s
aim is to discourage employer sponsored health care in order to increase competition among the insurance companies.

It’s his “free market” solution to our health care crises like other Republican sponsored “free market” solutions weighted heavily in favor of the supplier rather than the consumer.

It is windfall for the insurance companies.

Those who know about Alaska's internal politics are implicating Governor Palin for the same type of problems as Senator Stevens. How much of the Governor Palin's election costs were paid for by the big Oils?

Why would want anyone want a healthcare plan where the paitient can pick any medical services provider anywhere in the country (doctor, labs, hospitals, physical therapy, etc.) such as that provided under Medicare Parts A and B when you can sign up with an HMO that routinely limits you to specific providers and locales while offering to pay its' CEO $1.4 Billion Dollars over a two-year period (United Healthcare)?

If you are Medicare eligible, the United Healthcare Medicare Advantage plan also demands and receives a bonus of somewhere between 7% and 14% over and above what Medicare spends on those who use Medicare Parts A and B.

Mark, verse 25 (see above), tells it like it is!

We the United States people should learn a great deal of lesson from the Democrat controlled Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac and what it done to Wall Street and Main Street.Did I hear someone whisper government controll healthcare,please don't the $700.00 billion dollar albatross around our neck is too much.

The special interests and lobby groups want to buy government decisions on the cheap and take advantage of Americans without having to deal with the complex results that might cripple our nation. They get people from the top of their class to represent them and manipulate to take advantage. We are too lax about the possibility that we might be represented by those from the bottom of their class and that we might be making it easy for the special interest lobby group to take advantage of us. Again!!!
Having effective and timely studies by our government led by those from the top of their class has been lacking at great cost to us all and not just in health care. We have lost planes due to neglect in the timely study of flight manuals. We have lost lives and livelihood due to neglect in the timely study of intelligence information. We have lost a solid economy due to neglect in the timely study of needed regulations and deregulations. We have lost our standing in the world due to neglect in the timely study of diplomacy and when and how to successfully use it. We have lost health care reform due to neglect in the timely study of health care. Let's be careful in rebuilding our country's capabilities.

Do you like the idea of the government bailout? Do you think the government will do a good job of handling all that money and seeing that everybody on your street is taken care of? No?

Well, what makes you think the government will do any better job of handling your medical care?

Please vote for Obama if you want to face federal regulations when you need health care. These will be federal regulations written by the same Federal bureaucrats that wrote the tax code. Oh, you thought that you would have federal universal health without regulations?

I am a 23 year old who has to pay 5,472/ year to keep insurance (Cobra- for up to 3 years) and has been denied any affordable insurance. The missouri pool was about 1000/mo which was the next most "affordable" plan. As an American who is trying to make it and get education and continue to gradschool and not have to rely on a husband who has a job with benifits, McCain's plan DOES NOT make sense. I know there are so many others who have to pay more or can't pay at all for the health care they need. The change needs to effect the health care insurance comanies themselves, not come from a 5,000 dollar handout for a family. and 2500 for an individual.

Hey James C #17: I am guessing that you have a current outstanding balance at your Dr office and most likely have been turned over to collections for it. How about you just pay your bill and get on with it. Try telling Wal-mart that they have a cap on what they can charge for milk so that they don't exploit you. The difference is, you can't get away with filling your basket with food and then telling the check out person that you don't have the money but Wal-mart makes too much money anyway so you are entitled to the food. Good luck with your nationalized healthcare-- you will get just what you pay for. Pay nothing ...expect nothing.

i belive obama can make a change towards health care along with other problems America has>