Plumbers disavow Joe

The fact here is, he presented himself as something he is not, Listen I helped my father with sink problems , boiler problems when I was young and still fix my sinks commodes etc,And if not ,I call someone who does indeed have a licence.
, He lied about buying a business that Isn't even for sale, And the owner says he only clears about 100.000 grand, the owner that is. union, no union, doesn't make a differance,hes a liar. I guess I could say I was a plumber to.This guy worries about Obama raising taxes,why should he worry! he doesn't pay his.another wanna be is all this guy is..real plumbers are the way to go

Man, am I the only one surprised that someone who can make more than $250,000 a year doesn't think to hire an accountant to keep him from paying higher taxes?

My mom used to work in an accountant's office where that's pretty much all they did - find nifty loopholes and investments and shelters so that rich people hardly paid a dime.

It's the American way!

argghh... what's wrong with people. Obama's plan would raise taxes 3% for the amount over $250000. The tax rate is currently 36% and it will be 39%. So if Joe made $280,000 he would be taxed at 39% for $30,000 (increase of $900 dollars). The people who will be hit "hard" by this would be millionaires. And by hard I mean their accountants would have to tell them so they know to be outraged. Joe of course will not make that much. Poor republicans tend to be people who vote with the republicans because they think maybe, one day, they will be rich. The median salary in the US is 32k. If you make > 250k you are in the top 3 percentile. I guarantee all who are posting here are not.

Hey all you people shrieking about socialism, you realize that McCain is putting forth socialist ideas too, right? Specifically with his economic plans.

Kill the messenger! Not exactly a new idea, but one that the media is very good at when it serves their purpose.

I heard about a plumber on Long Island that made very good money clearing the drains of wealthy women's plumbing, if you get my drift. Never complained about his taxes but died before he reached 50 of herpetic hepatitis. Two points of relevance: (1) nothing comes without a price and (2) no good deed goes unpunished.

I concur, Jason, what a bunch of idiots. It pains me to know that you all will reap the benefits from Obama’s upcoming presidency.

THE REALITY CHECK IS THIS...CAN JOE THE PLUMBER SEE RUSSIA FROM HIS ROOF TOP?

Joe, The Plumber, is one of very few Obama ralliers, that has a brain. Good for Joe, he is a real man, with at brain, to get the socialisim Obama is trying to spread. Those poor union members backing obama, will soon find out what a hugh mistake they made. Am praying for Joe to be the biggest and best plumbing co. the world has ever known. GO JOE!!!!!

---Are we about to elect our first 'MEDIA INDUCED PRESIDENT' !

The media has favored (fawned over) Obama to an unprecedented level:

-‘Skunk Man’ Jay Leno’s and ‘Snag Headed’ David Letterman’s non-stop jokes about McCain and few if any about Obama !!

-The Saturday Night Live Crap-Crowd & Tina Feign’s non-stop incriminations (which poles have shown indoctrinate feeble minds).

-CNN and the rest of the liberal media ‘fawning’ over Obama in such blatant fashion.

-Hollywood entertainment type programs showing their bias for Obama, very blatantly.
(like: Ellen ‘Degenerate’ & Barbara WaWa on The ‘Bitch’ View)

-The Oliver 'bonnerless' Stone movie “W”. A genuine Docu-Drama (a license to Lie) from one of Hollywood’s most ‘Irresponsible’ directors.

- Matt the ‘bitch boy’ Damon & Keith ‘GoOfy’ Olbermannn !!

(Do we need any more proof of a Liberal, ‘Bigoted’ Media!!!)

ETC., ETC., ETC.

Is the Media Helping Obama to steal an election!!!

Joe the Plumber needs to use some of Obama's eduction initiatives to learn some math on how much better off he, actually not even being a plumber, would be under Obama. And for the scrutiny, Schmoe the Dumber should thank McOld for using his poor uneducated bald head for ammo. Don't be too stupid to think for yourself, do the math, quit being a racist, turn of Rush and Fox then go vote.

At least Joe th Plumber gave more interviews yesterday than Palin has given sinc she was nominated.

If this is what republicans call teh result of 8 years of "prosperity"...I vote for Socialism. Death to the right wing.

thats because these union plumbers are ripping off the customer..just like obama is ripping off americans with his lip service and avoiding issues...just like he's using joe to hide his ACORN corrupt association. Unions are nothing but protection for the useless and lazy.

What has our politics fallen victim to
When a voter's question honestly asked
Elicites rath upon the questioner
So as to not dare mar Barack's halo.

My experience is that union plumbers are lazy bums, and would therefore love Obama, who will ensure they can burrow their snouts in the public trough and ride on the backs of hard-working people.

That $5,000 tax credit is NOTHING compared to what real medical insurance will cost a person. Forget it if you have a PRE Existing condition, which MANY people do have. Obama will get the money to fund these programs by CUTTING OUT the programs that have failed. McCain is NOT FOR THE MIDDLE CLASS!

Posted by Kevin Lindquist October 17, 08 01:05 PM said:
Sure, McCain plans to tax healthcare benefits but he is also giving $5,000 to assist with medical expenses, so it's basically a wash. Does anyone know where Obama is going to get the money to fund his programs?

Roger:
Your quote below says so much about your ignorance about socialism that its scary!! You know that Canada, Europe, Australia and New Zealand are socialist countries right? Every one who goes to Canada says: Wow - free healthcare, education and what amazing roads you have. Guess what meathead? Its a socialist country, and yup- its pretty nice up there! Its the education part you seem to be lacking!
Go socialism and Obama.

And the real subject is that NOOBAMA has a SOCIALIST MENTALITY...
Well guess what - Why do not you write something telling Barack Hussein Obama should go and run for president in Cuba – or North Korea.. or perhaps go to Venezuela.. and in 2012 run against Chavez...

Write something about that… or are you a socialist newspaper?

The reason we are attacking the messenger, is because this was obviously a cheap political stunt that was busted in broad daylight. What obama said really means nothing, because you can interpret it any way you want.
"spread the wealth around" meaning=Im taxing you and giving it to the poor "spread the wealth around" meaning=im taxing you so i can create jobs for people building infrastructure or for job training programs So it seems anyones political leanings makes them think one way or another about what obama said.
For us Independents who arent voting for obama or mccain anyways, we think this is hilarious. The GOP paid some guy to attend an Obama rally, he got lucky and asked a pre-arranged question, and two days later was called out and busted!

Wow, you righties get really psychotic these days. Seriously, you have nothing on "The Chosen One" (whatever that means) without a smear. Okay, Obama served with Ayres... and what? When are you going to let-up? Does Obama have to lie to you and say he's been in cahoots with a terrorist being that lies are all you people seem to respond to? About Acorn? You gotta be kidding me... there's nothing there either. About negative campaigning: 30% of Obama's ads compare and contrast vs. 100% of McCain ads that say nothing, nada, zero about how McCain would fix the economy, end or win the war, prevent terrorism, repair healthcare, and mend burned bridges lit by W. & Rove over the last four years. And about the plumber. Well, he doesn't make $250,000 a year; he makes ~$40,000. But, moreover, if he purchases the business (which also has been proven to not make greater than $100,000/year), he would have to carry home (post wages, materials, property, etc) $250,000 in a year which is damn near impossible for a small business. Furthermore, the average tax hike for these guys will be around $128 per year. Help me understand how this will burden the wealthy? This will kick start the economy for a small, justifiable, sacrifice of the top five percent of America's wealthy. Now remember, George Bush gave a disproportionate tax-cut to these same wealthy Americans (or, perhaps not, as many of these so-called Americans don't pay taxes as they moved most of their money over seas). So, the bottom 95% have been paying many, many more taxes than the uber-wealthy. The major difference between W. and O. is that O. has told us what he's up to. I know, I know: you righties prefer back-room deals rather than up-front legislation. But, true Americans appreciate transparency and truthfulness. Your campaigns should try it sometime. Perhaps if McCain actually did put Country First and tells us what he's planning to do with our money and faith in country he wouldn't be so far behind in the polls. Perhaps, if the G.O.P. didn't open each campaign with smears, lies, and negative ads, they would have developed trust with intelligent, well intentioned Americans like me. Oh, I'm kidding. Talk like that might be good for picking a leader, but it doesn't do any good in winning a campaign.

Joe the plumber is a fraud. Why are you all perpetuating his 15 minutes of fame? The “Joe the Plumber” incident is yet another McCain attack tactic that not only fizzled but backfired.

gObama!!

Those who are licensed contractors pay a lot of fees and taxes. Those who are unlicensed are breaking the law, plain and simple.

Posted by Sam October 17, 08 01:36 P

WTF r u talking about . . . it cost me 42 bucks for 2 years to renew my license. little minds should be seen and not heard! UI don't know about ohio . . . but in PA there is no plumbing license. Your reputation makes you, or breaks you. Union guys are required to test out in PA, according to the standards the uniopn sets . . . most states require a license whether your union or not.

"Joe the Plumber" doesn't exist. This is a fabrication of a desparate old man who sees his dreams tumbling because he sold his soul to some really cheap politicians. I feel sorry for McCain. He deserves better, BUT he did sell his soul and now he'll have to take the heat.
This is a prime example of the difference between a "tactic" and a "strategy". McCain''s supposed "strategists" can't see any further than the next news cycle and have give this poor old man some really bad advice. When it boils down to facts, we have two good guys but only one good campaign....

JOE THE PLUMBER IS A FRAUD! HE DOES NOT HAVE A LICENSE AND WILL NOT MAKE $250,000.00 IN 2009.

FELLOW GOP's MEMBERS, WE MUST REALIZE DEFEAT AND COME BACK STRONG IN 2012 WITH THE MITT ROMNEY TICKET.

MITT ROMNEY FOR 2012 BECAUSE McCAIN IS TOAST....BESIDES I DONT WANT A SOUR LOSSER (2000 PRIMARY ELECTION), AND HIS WIFE A DRUG ADDICT IN OFFICE.

Ben 10 is a Plumber.

As a Colorado homebuilder I watched the first newscast on Joe and immediately my instincts kicked in. My subcontractors - some of them - have conservative talk radio blaring all day. They are hard workers but being tradesmen know very little about business management and often get into trouble. Joe the plummer is like millions of these guys who have become puppets and regurgitate the Republican talking points ad nauseum. Joe is on the extreme though in that not only is he a fraud but a lier. You ask them if they know what the Gilded Age was, what was the root cause of Great Depression, they're clueless. Homebuilding is taking a dive and jJoe thinks he can fool us that he and his buddy Al are pulling in $250k. He is a joke and a disgrace to honest working folks.

Does this sound familiar:

Nevertheless, in most advanced countries, the following will be pretty generally applicable.

1. Abolition of property in land and application of all rents of land to public purposes.

2. A heavy progressive or graduated income tax.

3. Abolition of all rights of inheritance.

4. Confiscation of the property of all emigrants and rebels.

5. Centralization of credit in the banks of the state, by means of a national bank with state capital and an exclusive monopoly.

6. Centralization of the means of communication and transport in the hands of the state.

7. Extension of factories and instruments of production owned by the state; the bringing into cultivation of waste lands, and the improvement of the soil generally in accordance with a common plan.

8. Equal obligation of all to work. Establishment of industrial armies, especially for agriculture.

9. Combination of agriculture with manufacturing industries; gradual abolition of all the distinction between town and country by a more equable distribution of the populace over the country.

10. Free education for all children in public schools. Abolition of children's factory labor in its present form. Combination of education with industrial production, etc.

Looks like were almost there!
Lifted straight from the Communist manifesto.

Say it loud and say it proud: UNION YES

Joe (the not plumber) is another classic Repub stooge: "I'm a tough working class guy with friends in the military and who hates Social Security."

Reality check: real working class guys know they have to FIGHT for each other, many are vets themselves, and most have family members surviving solely on Social Security.

Joe the Plumber... the perfect end to this farce of a campaign (and I'm sorry that McCain was the sucker left holding the bag for these schmucks... he deserved better... to bad it wasn't Rudy)

Joe the Plumber doesn't understand taxes, and John McCain used that to misrepresent Obama's tax plan.

REVENUE is NOT the same thing as INCOME, and especially, TAXABLE INCOME.

So, if the plumbing business has $280,000 revenue, as Joe claims, then the acutal taxable income would probably be far less.

98.6% of small businesses would not be affected by Obama's tax plan, as shown by a CNN fact check. McCain's claims distort the truth.

Joe the Plummer got off easy this election.Poor Chad was hung in the Bush/Gore election.Joes not the first person who never ran a business before, to think he will make a killing.Seeing only the pay coming in and having nothing to do with the bills,wages, etc. that come with it will make you think so.If he ended up in the tax bracket affected by a PROPOSED tax hike and, if thats all it took to prevent him from operating a business, then it was never a real propect anyway.Taxes rise then so do your charges to the customer and it cancels out eventually in the long term.

I feel sorry for Joe as he is just a "diversion" in a flailing and panicked GOP campaign.
I hate to say it Republicans but it is we will win this time. Obama is not to blame, nor is McCain, it is simply that we somehow allowed that moron of a President to stay in office for 8 years. Listen your party started this and it is time that we simply turn the tables and insult you as best we can with an ultra liberal Black President.
McCain is to old, to angry, and to desperate to win. Palin, come on, simply a joke.
And poor Joe, he is the true average guy, that will probably go from copper pipes to crack pipes after this and do you think anyone will care. Well Dem's will.
Maybe Barak will give him a job at the white house as a gardener, at least until he gets his plumbing certification.

The anti-taxation, anti-regulation, anti-government, anti-personal freedoms, cabal of pick-up truck republicans, investment club republicans, and social conservatives is so yesterday's news. They've effectively destroyed the economy of the 20th century's greatest country and yet on they whine about the leftist agenda, softly bleating out like condemned sheep the hopeless, miserable last gasps of a dying breed. Buh-bye.

Obama is a stranger to the public, Biden is a liar. They are what the Democratic party has got. Obama has been trying to link Mccain to Bush because he knows Bush is facing problems with the war and the economy. McCain and Palin are tough people, they will meet the challenge of America. Obama and Biden are lying to get votes.

During the last debate, Brack Obama claimed he has stood up to his party. He said he has stood up to Environmentalists, and Unions, who I guess he thinks are his party since the democrates are so beholden to them.
Well, I guess Brack is not standing up to his party this time since "Joe the plumber" isn't a union member the hardships he is facing in these economic times don't matter to him.
I thought he was running for President of the United States, who "if" elected talkes an oath to represent all the citizens of this country.
I guess Obama is running for President of "some" of the states and will pick a choose which citizens he will represent. "Sorry Joe".

So...exactly how did McCain get Joe to step into the campaign to help out...oh yeah...he arranged for Obama to knock on the guys door...

If we are to believe the radical left, this was all manipulated somehow by the RNC...and they call Joe's dream of owning a business a fantasy...please people...understand that there is nothing objective left in the media today...it is all subjective...only some of the ones reporting the events of the day tell us up front that they have an agenda...and some don't...like Brian.
We don't need gun control...we need MEDIA Control...with financial penalties tied to reports that are misleading or that are abjectly false. Perhaps this way, opinion pieces would have to be marked as such. So...instead of trying to undermine the 2nd amendment, let's fix the damage being done by those who are abusing the 1st amendment! Let's return it to Freedom of Speech rather than freedom of the press...
Let's require those who report on politics and government to publish their party affiliation/registration and voting records so we can understand their true intent and recognize the motivation that lies behind writing some piece of drivel like this.
Perhaps then, the voting public will have a fair shot at sorting fact from opinion and will be able to filter out the rhetoric and distortions presented by those who do have a dog in the hunt..whether they want to admit it or not...

Jim Zien - I don't think there is ANY evidence that Obama's plan would raise taxes on small businesses that GROSS $250k. It's only those that EARN $250k, which would be after salaries and other expenses. That is what McCain keeps ignoring,

And we have always had a graduated tax system. People who make more have always paid a higher percentage than those who make less. This has been revised over the past several years and it is an obvious thing to fix if you need money. Why all this talk like it's something that has never been done before? Oh wait, it's because it sounds good in the press, right?

Quite a common theme of the Reagan Koolaid drinkers. Taxes are bad, redistributing wealth is socialism. Two thoughts:
Without taxes, how the heck are we going to pay for this mess we're in. Oh yea, BORROW and pass it on to the next generation. Now that's being a wimp, no a spoiled brat.
Now for redistributing the wealth. I've only been working a blue collar job for 40 years. In that time I've seen my wages and benifits (inflation adjusted) stay the same or decrease while CEOs pay goes from around 100 times to 400 times average pay. The top 5% hold about 50% of the wealth.
Talk about class warfare; looks like the rich have used crony capitalism to redistribute the wealth to them by keeping my wages and yours low. The only way us little fish have to bring it back in allignment is with taxes or unions.

Jim Zien,

I applaud you. As an idiot making more than a quarter million a year, you sure have hit the jackpot. Do you have time to even think working 87 hours a week? Obviously not.

To Jim Zien....tricked into voting for Bush? and then getting sold out? well, that's your f***** problem, isn't it, for being so stupid. Foxy Sarah? How about Bambi? Which is more like it...she's not fit to run a daycare center never mind our country. I guess you haven't noticed she has nothing intelligent to say about anything except bash someone else's character. She couldn't eveb tell Katie Couric where she gets her news from (and she was asked twice)...must've been a tap dancer in another life. Maybe you should get your brains out of your pants......

Vote for Jesus, Vote McCain.

A am a republican that supports Obama. The Obama bashing that is going on here is so transparent. The guy is smart and articulate. It seems to me that other republicans just want more of the same politics as usual. Don't get me wrong, I have a tremendous amount of respect for McCain. I am a republican. I just think that Obama will be a better president.

Do we really know the facts? Is this guy "Joe" really a plumber - does he have a license? Is he bonded and insured? How much an hour is $250,000.00? Well, 120 dollars an hour is just under $250,000.00 per year given 40 hours per week for 52 weeks with vacation pay. Is this the "average Joe"? I think not.. For the past year, the median household income was just slightly over 50,000 dollars per year. Funny how people get their facts all screwed up. We are lost in rhetoric. You right-wingers accuse Obama of being a "socialist" and "palling around with terrorists" and say he will take all your money. What about George W. - how much of our money has he taken? 700 billion? What about AIG and their lush vacations? What about war? How much has war cost us? How quickly we forget.

rs:

Joe is voting on PRINCIPAL... something most democrats don't have! He said he would LIKE to eventually earn $250K and does not believe that America was built on the pricipals of taking the hard EARNED money from the "rich" to give to people whom have NOT-EARNED said money!

Everyone in the USA is given opportunity to make of themselves what they wish! IT IS NOT governments place to decide who has been too successful or successful enough that they can take their hard EARNED money in order to give it elsewhere!

The fact is: Progressive liberals whom have, for all intents and purposes, taken over the democratic party believe in a SOCIALIST or QUAZI-COMMUNIST agenda! IT DOES NOT WORK... SOCIALISM INHIBITS AN INDIVIDUALS DRIVE TO SUCCEED BECAUSE THEY HAVE A SAFETY NET... LIKEWISE IT INHIBITS THOSE WHOM HAVE BEEN SUCCESSFUL BECAUSE THE MORE THEY EARN THE MORE THEY HAVE TO GIVE AWAY! So, if you think socialism works... all you have to do is look at the socialist countries who all but BLOCK individual success! This is not a race issue either... there are more minority (especially African-American) millionares then ever! This is trying to create class warfare when they should be trying to make everyone a SUCCESS instead of trying to take away success!

Liberals are complete fools...

Winston Churchill said it best: "If you are not a liberal at 20, you don't have a heart... but if you are NOT a CONSERVATIVE at 30, you don't have a brain!"

Many Democratic leaders have personal problems. Bill Clinton made out with Monica, John Edwards was involved in a another woman , Jesse Jackson, John Kennedy and now Obama. If a presidential candidate has serious personal problems, he should not be a president. Voting for that candidate is like helping him sell the country . Obama has been associated with Ayers , Wright and a PLO member. How do we know if his vision won't be affected by those people especially the democrats are controlling Congress.

Many Democratic leaders have personal problems. Bill Clinton made out with Monica, John Edwards was involved in a another woman , Jesse Jackson, John Kennedy and now Obama. If a presidential candidate has serious personal problems, he should not be a president. Voting for that candidate is like helping him sell the country . Obama has been associated with Ayers , Wright and a PLO member. How do we know if his vision won't be affected by those people especially the democrats are controlling Congress.

It amazes me on the level of ignorance some people display. First, "Joe the plumber" IS NOT A PLUMBER! he is a guy working without a license as a plumbers apprentice. the business he states he is getting ready to purchase is a company thta he is employed by. that would be the plumber (his boss) and himself. Purchasing that comapny would entail paying for the naming rights of the company (to get past clients calls and company history established). I would liek to know the plumber that is a single plumber practice that makes $250k NET per year. The people spouting off about how Obama is screwing the small business are not small business owners. they are employees of other companies. If you were a business owner you would understand the difference between NET profit and Gross revenues. My small businessdoes $365k a year gross revenues. BUT, only 117k Net profit. That is because of payroll, inventory, etc. What Obama refers to is NET profit. So if "Joe the Plumber" is buying a company that is doing $250k NET profit then the business is doing a lot more in revenue then $250k. Hence i would like to know the single plumber business that is doing $250k NET and i would be more then happy to change careers and start doing plumbing. because apparently you don't need a license to work in the field. Which is B.S., i have several friends that are union A/C and Plumbing and they work their asses off for their pay. It is no where near $250k/yr. and they know a lot more then "Joe the Plumber". Joe screwed up because he tried to play a game with Obama (cornering him and embarrassing him) and he lost his ass. Hence, screw with the bull and you get the horns! He is an admitted conservative rebublican, so he wasn't asking the question to see if Obama was the man for him but to try and embarrass Obama. I guess it didn't work out for him. i guess he should have asked for more money form the McCain campaign for putting his ass on the line for the five minutes of fame.

how come nobody noticed poor joe sitting on his couch watching the debates. Who knew ahead of time he was going to be in the spotlight, who took the picture, lol. Can you not see this was all a set up.the question is, by whom. I will give you one "other" guess.

As I read all these comments, I see a pattern emerging. People who support Obama stand tend to be on the receiving end of Obama's "redistribution of wealth" and the ones who support McCain tend to be on the losing end of Obama's plans. As many others have so aptly pointed out, Joe the Plumber is not the issue - government taking from those who earn it and giving to those who don't earn it - THAT'S the issue.

Read what a famous observer of the new American nation had to say:
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years.

Great nations rise and fall. The people go from bondage to spiritual truth, to great courage, from courage to liberty, from liberty to abundance, from abundance to selfishness, from selfishness to complacency, from complacency to apathy, from apathy to dependence, from dependence back again to bondage. -- Alexis de Tocqueville

Obama is inexperienced to be president and Biden is a boring guy who has a very low IQ. You draw your own picture for the future of America.

OOH!! Socialistic...liberal...intellectual...highly educated...spread the wealth...OMG, how utterly scary!!!
All of you gullible "right" leaning facists couldn't make an informed voting decision if your lives depended on it, because you've been brainwashed by the republican fantasy machine. Read your American history all you simple (minded) folks. The economy has historically performed much, much better under democratic and liberal administrations. You're all so smitten that you're actually voting against your own best interests. You actually have to read and educate yourselves on all perspectives regarding history because the republicans will never admit their abject failure at being able to govern responsibly, not only in economic terms but also in military and foreign policy matters. I'm certainly not saying that the democrats are not without their faults, but it doesn't take alot of insight to see what the "republican " revolution has brought upon our beloved country.

A Proud "Liberal"

You Go Joe!!!
McCain can go with him too!
Palin is going on SNL - good luck with that.
We just might need a little Socialism to get things fixed.
I say give Obama your vote and let the Dems give it a shot, Reps had theirs...

Redistribute The Wealth
Such as Golden Parachutes
Such as Stock Options
Such as Getting paid millions while driving your company into the ground
THAT is the redistribution of wealth that we have all lived with for too long...it is time to redistribute the wealth back to the people that are actually earning the company it's profits, The Worker!
"Redistribute the Wealth" is not always socialistic...not when you are just trying to tilt the playing field back to some semblance of fairness...Those CEOs whose companies we are bailing out should be hung and all their ill-gotten millions should be "redistributed" to the families of those that they "laid-off" to gain one extra point in their stock options.
Now, If you LOVE to be laid-off your job to make your CEO an extra point in the stock market, then by all means vote against "redistribute the wealth" and FOR THAT CEO that McCain thinks should get even MORE taxbreaks....the same CEO that laid YOU off so he could buy a Learjet.

Obama keeps changing his eonomic plan, first he said he would not drill oil because it takes too long to produce it and then he says he will drill oil. First. he said small businesses are taxed and later he said small businesses are exempt from his plan. First, Obama said he will sit down with anyone to solve international problems and later he said he will prepare before he sits down. Obama and Biden keep changing their minds to get votes. They are liars!

Regarding Joe the Plumber’s question about whether the growth of his business would force him to pay a higher tax rate under the Obama plan: If Joe’s business grosses more than $250k, that is certainly not his tax liability. He would have to make net profits of more than $250k to be affected by the Obama plan. 97% of small businesses never get there because there are so many expenses to deduct that tax liability is always limited. If the net profit is more than $250K, there is only a 3% difference between Obama's small business tax rate and McCain's small business rate on anything more $250K. So even if he made more than that, it would likely be offset by the additional benefit that Obama's plan offers: a per employee tax credit for new employees and the elimination of capital gains for small businesses. This doesn’t sound particularly “punishing” to me. I personally know and have known several small business owners and have never heard one say ‘I'm going to stop making more money because the government is going to take more of it.’ That argument doesn’t hold water.

Very importantly, the Obama health care savings and benefits to small business would more than make up for any modest tax increase. Joe the plumber has acknowledged that he would be better off with Obama, if he really was a plumber.

As it turns out, Joe is not really a plumber and has never held a plumber’s license, which is required in Toledo and several surrounding municipalities. He also never completed an apprenticeship and does not belong to the plumber’s union. The burly, bald man acknowledged he doesn't have a plumber's license, but said he didn't need one because he works for someone else at a company that does residential work. According to David Golis, manager and residential building official for the Toledo Division of Building Inspection, Joe does need to be licensed to work in Toledo. Ooops.

And then there was the matter of his taxes. Joe owes the state of Ohio $1,182.98 in personal income tax, according to Lucas County Court of Common Pleas records. In January 2007, Ohio's Department of Taxation filed a claim on his property until he pays the debt, according to the records. The lien remains active.

Real stand up guy…

ooooo. "socialism". so scary! i am soooo worried that we will fall into a socialistic style democracy, like England or Germany or France. how terrible! the right wing does not have a leg to stand on at this point. terrible economy, an idiot for a president, a shrinking middle class.... And Joe the plumber. Screw the misguided bastard. Taxes are always at the forefront of the tired, lame talking points of Republicans. Gops always argue that the rich won't have the incentive to be free and get richer if their are too many taxes. but businesses will thrive and stay in the US if we have more control over imports from freakin China and elsewhere, and rich people are not going to stop trying to make more money just because their taxes are slightly higher. Heck, even the gop has to concede government regulation of the stock market these days. It's as if all logic has been replaced with old worn out dogma and slogans with the right wing. they are like cartoon characters. think people. unless you are very very rich, there is absolutely no reason to vote for a Republican.

OBAMA 08'

Your complaining at a 250,000$ after tax bracket? Are you crazy? most Americans make 25 to 50,000 a year at their job which is the majority. I *WISH* i could complain about only making 250,000 a year, you are spoiled

The fact whether Joe is a real plumber or not is irrelevant, the point is Obama says he wants to spread the wealth around. Why does not Obama spread his wealth around? Any one that has worked all their life knows what will happen is that Obama's plan to spread the wealth means taking more away from working people and giving it to those would not work if a job slapped them in the face.
I simply like to say, that Unions are greatly to blame for putting people out of work, and closing up business, their demands have often been over bearing. To Obama, spread your own wealth and leave my alone.

Jenny (and others) - I am sick to death of hearing about how I support Obama because I'm a lazy, worthless bum who isn't willing to work for my money. I have three degrees, my husband and I both work, I'm trying to start a small business, and I sell things on ebay in order to help buy my kids Christmas presents. I don't have an opulent home and I didn't overextend myself on a mortgage I couldn't afford. But, I AM going to vote for Obama because: 1) I AM tired of exorbitant tax breaks going to wealthy corporations and a tax code that can be "worked" by individuals with more income in ways that provide them with great tax credits and deductions. I'm paying 28% of my income as taxes and I usually cannot file long form which means I automatically lose some tax deductions that I'm sure the wealthy ALWAYS get to take. I'm also certain that 28% of MY income is a lot harder on me than 35% is on Paris Hilton. 2) I look forward to having a president who is intelligent and has read the Constitution. 3) I want us out of Iraq (where we never should have been) and out of a war that Bush lied about to get us into. 4) I want the United States to quit engaging in torture and to stop ignoring international treaties that we used to believe were important (Take the Geneva Convention for example.). 5) I would like to think that we could retain a few of our constitutional rights here at home and believe that a complete change of direction is necessary before the administration completely shreds the Bill of Rights. 5) Caribou Barbie is NOTHING like any woman I know, is a step backward in women's rights and is dangerously incompetent to be even VICE President of the United States. I'm sure there are other reasons...but it would take too long to write them all.

skmj,
I wish you were here right now so I could smack your anti-democratic double-speaking ass around.

Joe the Fake Plumber is an Idiot. Just like you.

This whole argument has gotten a bit out of hand. With the vehemence of opinions on both sides, I doubt if anyone is going to change anyone else's mid with their comments. I also doubt that either candidate "has it in" for the US, but people this year are acting like the guy they're not voting for is the freaking AntiChrist. It's dumb. Look, here's the deal. When most of you are saying that this is not about Joe, you're right, obviously. This is about taxes, and I was not aware that it ever was about anything else. Also, what did Joe expect was going to happen with this? He put his own life under a microscope and now everyone is supposed to feel sorry for him? I personally don't care how much he makes or if he owes any back taxes or if he has a license but I'm sick of everyone either trying to make him a martyr or bring out the torch and pitchforks. Anyway, as pointed out previously, he would actually get a tax break under Obama's plan. Either way. If his company that he's theoretically going to buy makes $250,000/year, then after he deducts expenses then he's making what? Oh right, LESS THAN $250,000 A YEAR. Can we just be done with this now?

All you people who call "Joe the Plumber" ..........He's NOT A PLUMBER. HE DOESN'T HAVE A PLUMBING LICENSE AND DOESN'T MAKE 250K A YEAR AND, GET THIS..........HE'S A TAX DODGER. LINE HIM UP WITH ALL THE DEAD BEAT DADS!

My father is retired Local 12 and is voting for McCain as am I. Obama is a socialist and will severely mess with this country. I know I do not want government running my life. Vote McCain Local 12, it may not be the best vote, but it better than the Obama alternative.

Ignorance fears intelligence.

As the owner of a plumbing company I applaud Joe the Plumber. The most sane person in politics.

"Spreading the wealth around"? Ooooh, scary socialism!

By all means, let's vote McCain in so he can continue Bush's policies of concentrating the wealth into the control of fewer and fewer people.

The division isn't -- as one person here speculated -- between those who would benefit under a McCain administration and those who would benefit under an Obama one. It's mostly between people who can do basic math and people who can't. (And believe me, if you want to run a business, you better understand basic math.)

"Joe" the "Plumber" would actually currently pay *less* tax under an Obama administration. Even if "Joe" did manage to buy that business and even if he did manage to gross more than $250,000 -- *and* report all of that (ha) -- he'd be paying a little extra tax only on the amount above that magic number. If that's going to drive him out of business, maybe he'd be better off not buying the business in the first place.

It's because Joe's company won't overcharge and under work like our lazy union workers.

The private equity guys, the investment bankers, the hedge fund managers whose greed got us into the worst economic crisis since the Great Depression are paying 15% federal taxes and LAUGHING at the working class people screaming "socialism" any time someone suggests that Steve Schwarzman, who pulls in $20M-$200M a year, should pay his fair share of taxes.

Look, we're all capitalists here. The question is whether you want to have a system where people serve the markets or the markets serve the people. For 35 years now we’ve had the former. The rich have used the global economy as their own personal piggy bank by convincing everyone else that progressive taxation was akin to communism. But they sure came running back for the good faith and credit of "big government" when the bottom fell out, didn’t they? Privatizing profit and socializing risk: THAT’S socialism for the rich, boys.

You don't like paying taxes? Neither do I. But in business as well as government, the issue is VALUE. What are we getting back? Better schools? Quality health care? Decent roads and bridges? A cleaner environment? Nope, nope, nope and nope. Why is that? Maybe because we had a President who lied and then blew $1 trillion to $3 trillion (projected cost of Iraq war) destabilizing the Middle East. But he was someone you could have a beer with, so I guess he deserved to the most powerful man in the world.

People bitch about their money going to those who don't deserve it. Actually, I agree. Our taxes go to defense contractors. They go to guys like KBR and Halliburton who get no-bid contracts and fleece the taxpayers for hundreds of millions of dollars.

We spend more on the military than the rest of the world combined. And what do we get back? Security? Please. We spent trillions on weapons in the 80s and 90s and we got beat on 9-11 by 19 guys from Egypt and (DRILL, BABY, DRILL) Saudi Arabia who had box cutters you could buy for $9.95 at Home Depot.

One more thing: we have the freest market for healthcare in the world and we pay nearly twice as much per capita as any other nation. And that’s with 47 million uninsured and millions more with lousy insurance. The UK, France, Germany, Japan and Canada all pay less, all get better care and all have populations that are more satisfied with their system than Americans are. Health care costs are choking the economy – just ask General Motors. But hey, we can’t have better care, cover everyone and strengthen our economy with universal health care. That would be socialist!

I really hate to be the bearer of bad news, but we live in a pseudo-socialist state already. Obama is just proposing a tax plan that will make the middle class the beneficiaries of this pseudo-socialism rather than mega-corps and the wealthy. I love how the phrase "spread the wealth around" is treated with such disdain. As shocking as this may be to you right leaning folks, when everyone is better off then EVERYONE is better off.

socialism socialism blah blah blah. I make a pretty good salary and I dont mind sharing some wealth with my fellow americans. you greedy ba**ards only see the dollar signs anyhow. BTW america isnt true capitalism. In true capitalism the country doesnt step in to save businesses from going under. McCain is going to have a little man syndrome tempertantrum in the white house and push the button. A strong determined president is good. I wacko old guy still holding on to the past who calls his wife a c*nt is not who I want in the whitehouse. But who cares about how he treats women thats not representative of how he will govern right..If he doesnt have any respect for his wife do you republican crownies think he is going to respect you? BTW you can know everything about the whole planet and if you dont have the sense of honor and common sense to use that information wisely it will do you no good at all. Thats McLame

Obama is highly intelligent and surrounds himself with people that compensate where he lacks - such as Joe Biden, chair of Foreign Relations Committee. I take intelligence over experience any day - McCain screwed up with the Palin choice that he did not vet and now uses poor "Joe the Plumber" without checking out the legitimacy of the guy's story. Just another example of how he makes decisions. Massachusetts is a done deal - Massachusetts will give their 12 electoral votes to Obama. McCain people wake up!

It is ridiculous this discussion around Joe paying or not taxes.
The REAL issue is Barak spreading the wealth.
Well, one more leftist leader in Americas, to join Venezuela, Ecuador and Bolivia.

Umm, people, Obama isn't attacking Joe the Plumber. What on Earth makes you think destroying the guy is part of an attack plan? Obama just talked with the guy, it was McCain who brought him up (over and over and over). So the press did their job and looked into his background and found that he had no license.

And he's NOT making $250,000 a year. Joe himself even says IF he buys a business he MIGHT make that.

Yikes, Joe the GOP plant, errr, plumber is garnering much sympathy from the McCainiacs but NOTHING among actual plumbers. That leads us to what gimmick McCain will stumble upon next. Let's stop with the dirty tricks and smoke and mirrors and campaign on the issues.

This is so typical of the comedy show that is the McCain campaign.
1) Joe is not really a plumber
2) Obama's plan would LOWER not RAISE his taxes

Pity poor John McCain. He can't get anything right. His pick of Sarah Palin as VP is destined to go down in history as the most embarrassing political blunders in modernity. Sarah Palin qualified to be president? Yeah right. If you think so you its time to put down your crack pipe.

Turns out Joe the Plumber is not a plumber but a tax evader. He is also breaking the law when works on people's toilets because he is unlicensed. He owes the government taxes and has a lien against his house. And the notion that he has the wherewithal to spend a quarter million dollars to buy a business is a joke since he can't even pay his own taxes. One thing is for sure, in this economy he won't be able to borrow money for the business because the Bushy republicans--with John McCain being the staunchest advocate among them--have messed up our economy so much that the credit markets are virtually frozen. Turns out also that Joe the Plumber would make out better under Obama's tax plan than McCains.

For those of you who like what has happened to this country in the last eight years, go ahead and vote for Mr. McCain and his hockey mom running mate. For those who want things to change in Washington, with fresh ideas, vitality, and leadership--Obama is the only sensible choice. Of course, for those of you who really believe that Obama is a terrorist, a closet muslim, and an Arab, it is your constitutional right to vote for McCain. Exercise the franchise!

Peace be unto you.

Its not about being in the union people its being licensed. Being licensed to say you know what you are doing. Anyone can hang up a shingle and say they are a doctor if you don't have to be licensed and educated. Why the hell am I paying someone to do plumbing in my house without a license? If I want someone unlicensed then I'll get Plumbing for Dummies and do it myself. And its not about how much he'll make - I don't know anyone that owns a "small" business and makes over $250 in pocket. There are expenses to be met. And this guy is not your typical American - we all pay taxes don't we? Not forgo the money I owe the government just because I don't have it. Some weeks I can't spend more than $10 on groceries because I have to pay for taxes and insurance and you say where is Obama getting all this money to spend - tell me where is McCain getting his $5000 for insurance or his school vouchers?

You should call this UNIONS don't like Joe. . . .

To edeldoug: Taxes are imposed on profits, not "gross". So the plumbing business would need to "net" 250K, after expenses, for any increase in taxes.

Redistribute The Wealth
Such as Golden Parachutes
Such as Stock Options
Such as Getting paid millions while driving your company into the ground
THAT is the redistribution of wealth that we have all lived with for too long...it is time to redistribute the wealth back to the people that are actually earning the company it's profits, The Worker!
"Redistribute the Wealth" is not always socialistic...not when you are just trying to tilt the playing field back to some semblance of fairness...Those CEOs whose companies we are bailing out should be hung and all their ill-gotten millions should be "redistributed" to the families of those that they "laid-off" to gain one extra point in their stock options.
Now, If you LOVE to be laid-off your job to make your CEO an extra point in the stock market, then by all means vote against "redistribute the wealth" and FOR THAT CEO that McCain thinks should get even MORE taxbreaks....the same CEO that laid YOU off so he could buy a Learjet.

Yeah, that's exactly who the GOP should run for Congress in 2010, an unlicensed plumber who owes the state back taxes. Heck, he would be a great replacement for Tom Delay.

You don't need a plumber's license to practice plumbing...der...
And so what if he's eligible for Obama's tax cut...if he is successful in acquiring and building a business, just like anyone of us and he crosses the threshold to what Senator Obama considers 'rich', you will pay more in taxes.
It is pretty simple: democrats want more social programs and they try to tell you they will only tax the rich, but those programs will have a negative impact on everyone's well-being. Obama is not a centrist like Clinton was; if people think he's going to bring back the good 'ole days, it won't happen. McCain won't be much better, but at least I won't have the gov up my butt and my taxes will stay the same (or decrease?)...

Notice how unhinged some of these McCain supporters are? They are kind of scary, saying vicious things about Obama and anyone who might vote for him.

They know McCain is going to lose. And now they're going red in the face, like a three year old who can't have that new toy.

Grow up, people. And realize this: When you start calling Senator Obama dumb names like "socialist" and "traitor" and call out threatening remarks at Republican rallies, you don't get more people to agree with you; you only drive away anyone except the extremists who are already in your camp.

McCain is going to lose. And you're not going to change that fact by slurring him and his supporters and telling us the sky is going to fall down if Obama wins. Go get a life, guys.

whoa, I'm shocked!!! A labor union supporting Obama?????

Isn't Obama The One who will sign the Employee Free Choice Act into law thereby taking away your American right to have a secret ballot during a union election?

Isn't Obama The One who just wants to line the pockets of crooked union leaders by giving them more union dues?

I'm shocked. Shocked I say!!!!

Kevin Cotter, business manager of Local 12 Plumbers and Gasfitters Union was indicted for stealing union pension funds to pay for his summer home in Maine.

This guy is a CROOK big time!!

Go look it up.

Now you see what life will be like under the Obama Regime.

If you have a hard question to ask King Obama then your life will be turned upside down. It will be made a living %#@.

If you disagree with King Obama then you will be hounded by the mainstream media and EVERYTHING about you will be put on the front page.

If you challenge King Obama then you had better run and hide.

Think about it.

Feel the fear rising? Obama is a terrorist? The RNC is now sending millions of voice mails telling Americans that Obama is a terrorist. Karl Rove is back. We need to fight back with vigor and perserverence. Fear cannot be allowed to hijack this election!!!!

Read your history books people... I think that George W should be compared to Hoover and Obama compared to FDR (but republicans hated him too and thought he was a socialist). Funny how history repeats itself. I would like to know how many republicans that are on social security right now remember how it was before FDR?

Does the following sound familiar to anyone today?
"In the Great Depression the American dream had become a nightmare. What was once the land of opportunity was now the land of desperation. What was once the land of hope and optimism had become the land of despair.The American people were questioning all the maxims on which they had based their lives - democracy, capitalism, individualism. The best hope for a better life was California. Many Dust Bowl farmers packed their families into cars, tied their few possessions on the back, and sought work in the agricultural fields or cities of the West - their role as independent land owners gone forever. Between 1929 and 1932 the income of the average American family was reduced by 40%, from $2,300 to $1,500. Instead of advancement, survival became the keyword. Institutions, attitudes, lifestyles changed in this decade but democracy prevailed. Democracies such as Germany and Italy fell to dictatorships, but the United States and its constitution survived. "

Vote for McCain, the lesser ot two evils.

This great nation has been built on the principle that the government’s chief responsibility is to provide a favorable environment conducive to economic development as a nation, and improvement of quality of life of its citizens. Every individual citizen is entitled to prosper in this environment, and to be responsible for his or hers own wellbeing. Our government should not be in the business of taking responsibility for individual citizen by redistributing wealth because it kills the incentives for those who want to advance themselves to a higher level, such as the case of Joe the plumber.

Business creates jobs, and jobs create tax avenues for governments at every level. The Democrats’ obsession on punishing big business and Obama’s anti-business and socialist economic policies are sure to kill incentives for many businesses nationwide. When business stops hiring and it will lead to high rate of unemployment, which in turn will reduce the government tax revenue. In order to finance Obama’s economic promises which will cost hundreds of billion of dollars on top of the trillion dollars’’ bailouts, he has no other options other than printing more dollars to pay for all of his programs.

Obama’s promise that he will cut tax for 95% of the people is an absurd proposition considering that 35% of the lower income people pays no tax in 2007, and the top 25% of tax payers pays 75% of the total tax revenue, and the middle 40% pays the rest 25% tax revenue. How can a person who does not pay tax has a tax cut? It is obvious that Obama means that he will write a check to the bottom 35% “tax payers”. In the old days, we called it a “welfare check”, a form of bribery for votes from poor people.

Historically, wealth redistribution has proven to be a wrong approach to economic prosperity. I was born in China and know a bit of what socialism and communism work. When people was denied the opportunity to prosper under a “redistribution” system, they just become lazy and get by with whatever they are given. In the 1970’s, China finally kicked away, although gradually, the communism and become an economic powerhouse in a short 40 years. Now China is a bona-fide capitalist nation although under a socialist cover.

High tax takes away the needed capital for business expansion and more hiring. Under Obama’s plan, he will play Robin Hood, taxing more on business and giving it to the poor. How wonderful if it works, but it won’t because the government tax revenue will eventually dry up with the generous programs that he proposed. Now some democrats will say: “well, that is just election rhetoric; he will change his proposed programs once elected”. What that means is that one should not take Obama’s promises on its face value.

When many of the Obama’s programs to be enacted, they will required people to implement. That means a big government with agencies for program implementation. As we all know that government does not create wealth (business does!); it only administer the wealth collected from tax payers. The government, from Executive Branch to both houses of Congress are hired to do the job. But as you also know that they are not doing a good job as their approval rating drops to a dismal 17% in recent months. The $700 billion dollars bailouts manifest the gross failure of our government in recent decade. Many of the voters may choose to blame President Bush for the problem, which Democrats lead us to believe; others accuse the Congress present and the past for the failure. I think, it all comes down to the so-called “political correctness” that is advocated by the liberals. When the people with power in our government begin to loose up the credit requirements on purchasing house or opening a credit card account so that low-income people can enjoy the economic boom like every other people. It might be a very popular piece of legislation for those who previously were denied mortgages and credit cards, but it leaves a long-term problem for this nation to overcome. The current economical crisis has been rooted on the belief that the poor should be helped by the government; promoted by the greedy bankers and investors who took advantage of the ill-fated legislation and lax government oversight. In my view, it is too late, or even inappropriate to lay blames on investors and bankers who only reacted to the legislation and made the best of the rules. Investors, by nature, always seize opportunities to make a buck and they (most of them, I mean) are probably doing nothing legally wrong . The presidents and legislators present and the past, on the other hand, should be examined, criticized or even prosecuted in relation to this crisis. Because those who were involved or promoted these legislations betrayed the peoples’ trust and did a nation’s harm. They should be singled out and exposed to the public, so that we do not have to suffer this ordeal again because some politician‘s grand idea going out of control.

Any plumber who clears $250,000 after all his write offs is not middle class. He is a member of the elite upper class.

On the other hand, if he grosses $250,000 and claims it all on his takes, which would put him in the high tax bracket, then he is a moron.

Either way this gimmick by the McFailin campaign stinks, and it is obvious that the morons who still vote republican can't think for themselves.

Joe the plumber is a fraud. He's not licensed and according to the state of Ohio he's doing plumbing ILLEGALLY. His chances of buying the business he works for anytime soon are pretty low, since he needs to go to school, then work LEGALLLY as an apprentice, get a Master's license, then raise the money to buy this business which isn't even for sale. He owes $1200 to the state of Ohio for taxes (and for so long they attached his property). His chances of earning over $250K and having to worry about taxes in that range are pretty low for the rest of his life.

I hope the Republicans do run him as a cnadidate. He'll make Palin look highly qualified.

Chuck the plumber is not a homeowner or contractors worst nightmare. Despises his customers and obviously relishes in overbilling them. To even bill customers $250,000 in a year at $55/hour would require working an average of 12.5 hours in all 365 days of the year. (That's 4,545 hours) And that's before expenses.

I owned a small business for 20 years, which I considered pretty successful, yet I almost never "earned" a personal income of $250,000. 98% of small businesses never reach the point where they would face a tax increase under Obama, especially in the near term and especially under four more years of Republican Rule.

I'm a small business owner. I am struggling to survive, and I have to work hard just to do that. Joe the Plumber,or whatever his real name is, if his income is $250,000 per year, he doesn't get my sympathy. He's doing fine. If he owes back taxes with that sort of income, he's doing something wrong. I seriously doubt Obama's plan will hurt any small business owners. But I think McCain's health care plan will hurt us. McCain has flip-flopped on everything I thought he believed in: campaign finance reform, climate change, torture... and his pick of Palin is self-serving politics. "Country first"? Sounds more like "McCain First". I am voting for Obama.

What is wrong with not having a plumbers license?
The plumbers unions and licensing rules are designed to restrict competition to benefit people that have them. They just use it to jack up the price and keep others from entering the trade. Most people use personal references to get a good plumber anyway.

That fact that Joe doesn't have a license just means he's not part of the gang that controls the plumbing business in a particular area. Good for him.

I was so disappointed in John McCain to read that Joe-the-Plumber was just a McCain-Palin campaign stunt - - they set up Joe Wurzelbacher to intercept Obama and ask him that question. Come to think of it...how else was there a camera there ready to shoot film of the encounter and Obama's response? Right, so he could release it on YouTube than spin a way, making his usual false accusations about Obama's tax plan.

One big problem: McNasty's sick little trick has backfired. After McCain made such a big deal during the debate about Joe (a Republican it turns out...what a surprise...doggone, who'd a thunk!!??)many news outlets did the math, including today's NY Times. And what did they find out....if Joe-the (unlicensed as it turns out)plumber bought a plumbing firm that earned $280,000 in profits, Obama's tax plan would add another $600 to his tax plan.

Now, what were all those things McCain said about how Obama was going to tax everyone earning $42,000 and up into oblivion? Jeepers and doggone, betcha he and Joe-the-Plumber made a deal but didn't get their facts straight.

I earn my money by working long hours and saving every penny that I can throughout my entire life. I accumulate wealth by saving, investing and living modestly. Now after I retired, I plan to live in a happy and rich life. I have no desire to let the government to tax me more just because I make more from my retirement fund. If I want to help others, I can donate to charities on my own schedule without the government help.

Don't blame Obama for the current scrutiny of Joe-the-unlicensed-Plumber. John McCain is the one who decided to thrust "Joe" into the spotlight. It is therefore completely legitimate to point out that "Joe" is not what McCain claims him to be.
And for those of you who think "Joe" was simply an undecided voter asking Obama a legitimate question -- he is a registered Republican and grandson-in-law of McCain's old buddy Charles Keating. In fact, "Joe's" father served time for his role in the Keating Five S&L debacle. Talk about bearing a grudge!

Democrats and some republication have let us down for years. Fannie & Mack were play pens for the socialist democrats and in their minds encouraging and insisting on sub prime loans constituted restitution to the minorities. Have we paid enough yet you twits? Liberal democrats have a mental disorder. Sick,Sick

To those saying licensing is "designed to restrict competition" I have been a "licensed Journeyman plumber" for 35 + years. For 30 of those years, I have been a shop owner, so I think I know of what I speak. Licensing of this highly skilled trade is one way we can police our own trade to rid it of unqualified, untrained, and for the most part, incompetent plumbers. When a prospective employee does not posses a license and cannot get one, I won't send him out as a plumber. I think more of my customers than that.

Joe the faux plumber is a bigot who is almost as good at "tap-dancing" around making a legitimate, intelligent, coherent sentence as "Sammy Davis Jr." Not quite though.