Gays being kicked out of military at steady rate

Time for "Either Way, I Got Your Back"

Yawn...the military has much more important issues to deal with, like winning two wars. If homosexuals want to serve, they know the rules. Keep your private life private.

This article is troubling to any rationale person who wants equality for all humans. Is the military AFRAID of gay soldiers. Do they think that the military has sooo many attractive people that men and women will be attracted to people of the same sex...... pleeeease....

This was long overdue. I as a former Military Man; speak knowledgeably about fellow 'Service' men & women, whom desire fellow human beings with this 'distorted' mindset (having the right to speak 'frankly' because we put our lives on the line to protect this country's sovereignty); to be displaced from equivalent treatment with fellow male or female soldiers without this 'distorted' image of oneself. As a military person; one has to be clear headed & 'In their right mind!' We servicemen & women are unsure of the mental capacity of Homosexuals & Bisexuals! It would be unfair to discharge them from service (every woman & man has a right to serve their country; regardless of mental state); however their sexuality should have to be declared in the manner in which the difference between male & female soldiers are/is declared. Allowing for separate training & quaters.

I am gay. I want to enlist in the USMC. All my (many) liberal friends think I'm crazy, and I hear it from them in their looks and sneers and condescending remarks. Yet the Corps can't take me because I'm gay, even though I aced the entry aptitude exam, have a bachelor's degree (Notre Dame, magna cum laude), did 23 pullups, run a mile in 6:30, speak fluent Russian and Spanish and want to learn Arabic. I also notice how there is a disproportionate amount of translators and linguists who are gay and kicked out of the armed forces--at a time when we need intelligence. Something is wrong with this picture.

I am retired Air Force and I served on a separation board for a homosexual NCO. I voted to kick him vote on that separation board. I WOULD DO IT AGAIN. My Air Force does not need homosexuals in its ranks.

I can't imagine how it must feel to be gay and defending your fellow countrymen when many of those countrymen don't want you to even HAVE the right to defend your country or to partner with the beloved of your choice.

People say there are much more pressing issues at hand, and that is indeed true. However, when there is a systematic injustice perpetuated by the government, there is ALWAYS time to fight it.

"Yawn...the military has much more important issues to deal with, like winning two wars. If homosexuals want to serve, they know the rules. Keep your private life private."

Odumba, you might try having just an iota of respect for the gays and lesbians who ARE fighting those wars!

Thats fine, but hetrosexuals don't keep their sexual life private.
when I was in the service, many could not wait to hit the whorehouses.
many of them were married.

what!. let them fight let them back in! I sure as hell dont want to have to go fight. If we get into a serious war there is going to be no one left but woman and gays. how is the population going to grow!. unbeilievable. Send the illegal immigrants over there. then there will at least be some justifucation for giving them free medical, housing, food and social security

Jason - Keep fighting for your rights. You can serve me and my country any time.

Please pardon my ignorance on this issue -- I may get crushed for it on this blog, but what is the problem with "don't ask, don't tell" if you are gay? Why is this a big deal? If the policy doesn't affect your ability to serve -- and I don't believe that it does -- then why should it be relevant at all? Especially when, as suggested by certain commanders, by coming out, you could hurt unit cohesion, and thereby effectiveness? Why not just keep your mouth shut on your sexuality and just do your job? Again, if I don' t mean to be insensitive or anything, I seek to understand.

The arguments against gay men and women serving in the military are essentially the same as those from the past. Women shouldn't be allowed to serve because...blacks shouldn't be allowed to serve because...because ther're not like us and we know what the military needs to be. You would never know it was 2009 from this mindset. Our great-grandchildren will laugh at this debate.

The title of this article should be: Soldiers continue to use Army Dont ask Dont Tell policy to avoid deployments.

The real tsroy here is the fact that our nation no longer holds honor, duty, self-less service as important.

Gay people are just as capable of fighting America's neo-colonial, expansionist wars against basically defenseless third world countries, subjugating unruly peoples in the name of empire, and bombing the living hell out of stone age villages as are anyone. Whoops, I mean sptreading fredom and democracy. Of course. Gay "behavior" was rampant among the Roman Legions; it was practically required among the Spartans, the most ruthless fighting forces the world has seen.
Th ecurrent policy is not simply an example of outdated bigotry, but is demonstrably counterdproductive. Can the US military real afford to lose 13,000 servicepeople?

I see no problem with gays in the military, those that join the military are not the sterotype. They meet the requirements they should get to serve. I do see the problem the military has right now.

It is the rules. The military is based on rules. If they do allow someone to break the rules and stay then they have to do it for everyone. It would now apply to any rule that is broken.

Separate quarters would be good. The gay quarters would be tastefully decorated and would have the fiercest wine and cheese parties. All aboard boys!!!

Some of the Greatest military people where Gay, Alexander the Great, Fredrick the Great, the Greek armies that were lead by the Gay lovers known for their savage
fighting THE SACRED BAND OF THEBES, Also in Japan the Samuri, and in Africa the Zulu.Anybody with an education knows that Gays are the military, even Adolph Hitler and some of his top men were Gay.
Gays excel in every thing. The arts, the sciences you name it.
Maybe thats why they don't want them,because they fear them.

First of all, I find it disgusting that Obama can turn his back on such an obvious infraction of human rights. He is supposed to be tough and be able to face opposition. He is supposed to change the world. Yes we can, right? I guess we can't if someone says boo. Pathetic. Why are we still even discussing basic rights in the year 2009? This all should have been fixed a long time ago. Same goes for gay marriage, abortion, and any other controversial issue.

KEEP CHURCH AND STATE SEPARATE! If your beliefs are influenced by religion, you have no business weighing in. KEEP RELIGION OUT OF IT.

Jason, you can go and join the USMC.

Just don't tell them you are gay. If you really wanted to go and serve, nothing is stopping you.

The phrase "kicked out,' used in both the headline and Bender's article, is a pejorative one, which inherently means 'unjustifiably' kicked out, which makes this a biased, editorial story more suited to the editorial than news pages. Also, without checking the 2, the Center for Military Readiness is called a "right wing" group, but the pro-gay group, Servicemembers Legal Defense Network, is not branded with any ideological stamp. Typical Globo unreflective bias.

Jason wrote:

"I am gay. I want to enlist in the USMC. All my (many) liberal friends think I'm crazy, and I hear it from them in their looks and sneers and condescending remarks. Yet the Corps can't take me because I'm gay, even though I aced the entry aptitude exam, have a bachelor's degree (Notre Dame, magna cum laude), did 23 pullups, run a mile in 6:30, speak fluent Russian and Spanish and want to learn Arabic."

Jason, how did or would they know that you are gay? Is that the only, or the most important, fact about you? Telling people i am heterosexual would be almost the last thing i would tell anyone, partly because it is none of their business, but mainly because there are many more pertinent things about me that i tell people, that i am male, Catholic, right-handed, a Red Sox, Patriots, sports fan, conservatively political, a prolific reader, one of four siblings, uncle of 15, etc. etc. etc. and yes a heterosexual. Why gays have to identify themselves as gay first, as if that totally comprehends their persona, is beyond me. To me, that identifies them first with the 'gay subculture,' which is indeed revolting, as opposed to individuals homosexuals, who are as attractive or revolting as any individuals.

@Billybeantown:

I don't have a problem with your expressing your ideas, but at least do it in a way that is legible! If you have an opinion, state it with the correct words and grammar so that other people can understand, especially when your opinion is different from most of those around you. You're not only making yourself seem like an idiot, but also degrading the credibility of your post. Right now, your opinion means nothing to me because you sound like an uneducated bigot.

PS, the Center for Military Readiness is called "right wing," but the Servicemembers Legal Defense Network is not called 'left wing.' typical unconscious globo bias.

The Military has NEVER been a Democracy, although ours exists to defend it; by its purpose, a military organization must severely limit freedoms of expression & individuality, or the Chain-of-Command will cease to function and along with it -- the ability to effectively deploy troops into harm's way! During enlistment, prospective soldiers & sailors must profess that they understand this principle, and have no matters of conscience that would interfere with their carrying-out lawful orders from superiors. If gays enlist to protect our Country, then they are my heroes & have my abiding gratitude & respect; if they enlist intending to accomplish a political mission, then they have to accept that any such mission is contrary to Chain-of-Command, and they deserve the consequences that may flow from that! Since "fraternization" is already prohibited, any public declaration of a gay soldier's sexual orientation could certainly be construed as being deliberately and unnecessarily provocative -- like a monk jumping up during vespers, & yelling: "Surprise, I'm really Jewish!"

My point is, the Military is NOT even remotely the right place to introduce social reforms from the bottom-up (bad phrasing, I know...) -- If gays want to see military policies with respect to gays changed, then they should run for office!

Ok here is the issue, homosexuals don't feel they can be themselves in our armed forced. What they do not explain at all is that their partners can not join military support groups, they can not go to gay bars when they are off duty, can not being their partners to their very own homes because they fear being outted. See don't ask does not work. Don't ask means, don't get caught, if you are seen leaving a gay bar, you can be booted out of the military.
God forbid you choose to eat a bullet to defend you country and be gay. I mean we all know the terrorist only shoot at hetrosexuals.

DADT is a lie. Plenty of those in service get kicked out without saying or doing anything to bring on an investigation. Something as simple as a rumor by a hateful colleague can lead to separation. Currently, Maj Witt , a nurse, who served 19.5 years toward her 20 year pension is getting "separated" although she didn't say or do anything, but did live with her partner 250 miles from base. If it's on the books, it will get abused. Obama must issue a stop loss order, letting superiors know that they aren't doing their jobs if the allow good soldiers, sailors and airmen to be discharged for anything not-related to doing a good job, especially during wartime. Obama, you need to grow a pair. The military is used to orders.

"Telling people i am heterosexual would be almost the last thing i would tell anyone, partly because it is none of their business, but mainly because there are many more pertinent things about me that i tell people, that i am male, Catholic, right-handed, a Red Sox, Patriots, sports fan, conservatively political, a prolific reader, one of four siblings, uncle of 15, etc. etc. etc. and yes a heterosexual. "
Please.

Let's see how long you could go before your heterosexuality comes to surface based on a simple comment like, oh say, "My wife and I went to Aruba once, too...it was a great vacation."

"Why gays have to identify themselves as gay first, as if that totally comprehends their persona, is beyond me."

Well, let's see...because gay people are used to, and tired of, getting to know someone, and then when they DO find out you're gay, they either treat you differently or simply disregard you. When you get it out upfront, you know the playing field, and you don't waste time on someone who is incapable of seeing you BEYOND your sexual orientation. It's really quite simple.

It's "beyond you" because you have never cared to truly understand gay people. You've always simply judged them and expressed contempt for them.

As an israeli reading this article I was, as always when it comes to LGBT rights in the US, shocked about how backward your great America is when it comes to gay people!
Openly gay soldiers have been doing just fine serving in the TOP units in the I.D.F ever since 1993 and the Israli army is doing just fine, not falling apart and turning into a big orgy.
And obviously the gay soldiers has better things to do in Gaza (Or in this case, Iraq) than to try to rape each other. c'mon...
And no they do not have seperate training quarters!

Apparently deltaman does not know that very same argument was used as a justification for maintaining a racially segregated military. After George Washington, the next general to command an integrated military commanded in the 1950's. Interesting that George Washington could do it, but then suddenly it became impossible.

Actually, it's pathetic, and so is deltaman's argument.

As someone previously observed, our grandchildren will laugh at the conservative arguments here and view them with the same disgust we now view the passionate arguments once raised in favor of making certain niggers & women always knew their place.

gaudete:
Actually you and I have a lot in common: I too am male, Catholic (daily Mass attending), right-handed, a Red Sox, Patriots, sports (Notre Dame and Spurs--born in SA) fan, (somewhat) conservatively political, a prolific reader, one of (three) siblings. But a difference is that in the Corps, you could call your girlfriend/wife, carry a picture of you and her together, talk about her to your brother Marines with no worry of any official or interpersonal repercussions. I would have to, at best, say nothing, at worst, make something up and hide the truth. And I don't usually "first" identify as gay. But I don't lie if someone asks me, or if someone is saying something particularly ignorant or offensive. Most people are actually shocked when I tell them I'm gay, especially my Catholic and ND friends--people who meet me never think I am part of what you describe as the "gay subculture." All branches of the military ask their members to identify with a religion, and that goes on the dog tag, yet many people make assumptions based on your religion. I am as gay as I am male as I am Catholic as I am an Irish fan. But I could not right now ask the USMC to contact my husband (were I married) if something happened to me. I cannot live a lie or in hiding--I already did that for years. If any straight guy thinks that's not a big deal, let him try it out for 4 years pretending he has no interest in girls.

For those of you who say that gays should just keep their identity quiet, stop and think about what you said. One guy even said that he doesn't announce his heterosexuality so why should gays announce their homosexuality. Well here is the answer. Being gay is not just about the sex you have - it's an entire lifestyle. Here is a sample day for a heterosexual: Go to work, serve your country proud, meet your girlfriend for lunch and even introduce her to the guys, go home, watch Lost, then go out to a club with your friends. A day in the life of a homosexual may be go to work, serve his country proud, go and secretly meet his boyfriend for lunch, go home and hope that no one finds out he watched Will and Grace, then go out to a gay club and hope that no one in the military catches him there. Gays can’t just ‘shut up’ and keep it secret. I was in the military for 6 years. My boss sat us down every Monday morning and went around the table asking “who got some over the weekend.” A gay guy has to lie. At squadron picnics gays have to lie and say they are single. Straight guys can talk freely about the pretty women they see on TV or the one they just saw walking by. Gays not only have to keep their remarks to themselves, but they have to be extremely careful that no one sees their eyes and notices who they were looking at. So you see, it’s not as easy as just ‘keeping your private life private.’ It’s about lying, hiding your emotions, hiding your loved one, altering your living arrangements, watching your back, and putting up with homophobic slurs. Oh to be straight – I would do ANYTHING to be straight and not have to live like this – BUT I CAN’T. So I just hope that our government and our people open their minds to a side they may not have seen.

FYI- Adolf Hitler was NOT gay. Ernst Rohm, was and Hitler had him and a group of his officers liquidated on the Night of the Long Knives. Rohm was only tollerated for as long as he was useful. The Nazis dramatically increased penalties for homosexuality under Paragraph 175 of the German penal code, and gays were among the first groups to be sent to concentration camps when the Nazis first took power. Recent studies of Nazi documents held in the archives of former Soviet countries have updated the number of gay men exterminated in concentration camps to 55,000- thousands more were worked to death, died of starvation, or were simply summarily executed by the SS and Gestapo on being discovered.

I was kicked out of the Navy in 1981, I remember a officer coming to me and telling me how the captain, legal officer and several others told how they changed all my work evals from excellent to poor because it wouldn't look good to the pentagon. I(t's a shame that so many are so ignorant .

TWO POINTS EXPLAINING WHY THIS POLICY IS A PROBLEM:
1. Proponents of DADT warn that repealing the act will cause demoralization and lessen the effectiveness of the troops. However, the effectiveness of the troops is already being lessened by the discharges under DADT, especially by losing valuable intel provided by translators. Demoralization is unlikely, as the majority of current civilians with military futures ahead of them are statistically comfortable or indifferent to homosexuality. And unless I am much mistaken, statistics show that a little over half of military personnel feel the same way.
2. It inadvertently causes sexual harassment to women, as male molesters will often threaten to turn them in if they "get all dykey".

This is an utterly illogical law that actually promotes inefficiency. And for some amusing reason, many of the proponents of DADT seem to get fixated the fear of gays in the shower with them. Is this a telling peek into their psychology?

they treat everyone in the military that's not white and male the same way. it's not just the gays, but the blacks, the females, the foreigners, the minorities on any scale. can you believe that the same society that chose obama as our president still chooses to treat each other this way?