Kerry, voter have mini-debate

LE MARS, Iowa --It is an axiom of politics that candidates should play nice with the voters, cajole rather than challenge them. Then again, until yesterday, Senator John F. Kerry had never met Arie J. Olivier.

In the midst of his stump speech at a restaurant, before what seemed like a typically friendly crowd of 50 supporters and curious Iowa voters in this small town in the northwestern part of the state, Kerry was promising new government spending on highways and bridges when a voice piped up from behind him.

``Is this a socialist country or a capitalist one?'' asked Olivier, loud enough to startle Kerry and hush the room.

For a moment the presidential contender seemed unsure what Olivier was talking about. But then Kerry promised to answer any question the silver-haired man had on his mind.

``When does life begin?'' the 86-year-old Olivier asked the Democrat, an abortion-rights proponent.

Several audience members booed Olivier - some later said they knew him to be a hard-core, conservative Republican - but Kerry invited the man to a minidebate.

``There's room for everybody to have discussion,'' Kerry said.

The senator then tried to indicate that the wealthiest top 1 percent of Americans benefited disproportionately from the ``Bush tax cut.''

``No,'' Olivier corrected him. ``Congress voted for the tax cut.''

Kerry conceded that, but noted that he opposed the tax cuts, like many Democrats, because millionaires like the senator and his wife, Teresa Heinz Kerry, were the Americans enjoying the most tax savings.

``I'm for enlightened capitalism, not robber-baron capitalism,'' Kerry said.

``You're favoring the poor over the rich,'' Olivier said.

``I'm an entrepreneurial Democrat,'' Kerry said, and then contrasted the budget deficits and 3 million jobs lost in this decade to the balanced federal budget and several millions of new jobs during the 1990s. That economic situation, he said, was the result of ``the Democrats and Bill Clinton.''

``I'm not a class warfare guy,'' Kerry said, and contended that one American billionaire, businessman Warren Buffett, has said that tax cuts for the poor and middle class may do more to stimulate the economy.

Olivier then backed off. He noted that they were both veterans - Olivier at the Battle of the Bulge in World War II, Kerry in Vietnam - and, in the end, shook Kerry's hand. Then he gave the senator a small local guidebook and said Kerry had earned his respect (though he told a reporter he was still voting for Bush next year).

The mostly Democratic audience gave Kerry rousing applause for taking on Olivier, the owner of a mobile-home park in town. Kerry said he only hoped he could debate the same issues next year against President Bush.

One Iowan in the audience, Jim Rolfes, who voted for Bush in 2000, said he was now considering a vote for Kerry.

``It was pretty tense there, and it could have been a fight,'' Rolfes said. ``I've never seen a politician act that calm and composed, make his points like a gentleman. I was very impressed.''

Patrick Healy can be reached by e-mail at phealy@globe.com.