Dirty landlord tricks?

I haven't rented in Massachusetts, so I certainly can't speak to either the law or common practice here, altho I would note that brief googling suggests asking for a cleaning deposit is not unheard of in apartment ads. However, a cleaning deposit (which may or may not be refundable) is absolutely common on the West Coast and throughout the Midwest (especially if you have pets, but even if not). Sometimes it is non-refundable; sometimes you get it back if you clean to the landlord's satisfaction upon moving out. It can be a source of disputes if it is theoretically refundable but isn't.

Characterizing it as a "dirty trick" seems a little harsh, unless the landlord has a history of saying they'll refund it but they never do. Certainly this kind of landlord does exist and often are known about in the local community, so if you're connected in, you might be warned off.

I would walk.

My understanding is that an apartment needs to be delivered in "broom clean" condition and left in the same state when moving out.

If it's not left broom clean when moving out then that can be deducted from the security deposit. That's the way I've always had to do it.

I like to abide by the motto of "leaving things a little better than how you found them" so I usually scrub counters and tubs, mop the floors and vaccuum thoroughly. I once rented a rug doctor to clean up the carpets before we left. I've been fortunate to have good landlords.

I'm moving out next month and concerned about getting my deposit back. We painted the apartment with permission because our landlord said we could, provided we painted it back. Now the new tenants are moving in and they want to keep the colors. We're covering our butts by making them take responsibility (in writing, via e-mail to us and the landlord) for white paint when they leave, otherwise, we're painting it back now.

That being said, this is the first time a security deposit's been collected any place we rent and we never got a statement that it was placed in a bank account collecting interest. (I found out about this law just a few months ago.) I think MA law says that we get 5% interest if no account was used (sweet!) but this guy has been nothing but ulcer-inducing for the 2 years he's been our problem (no basic upkeep, repairs are slow, each unit has incidents in which the city had to be called for inspections, 2 units have had no heat for weeks on end during different winters).

For those of you who view the choice to buy a home as purely financial, I think this less financial cost of not being able to own a dog, plant a garden, or paint your walls, or deal with half-a**ed efforts should seriously be considered when people say that its idiotic to buy. Its idiotic to buy at the wrong price, but its idiotic to live under these cirumstances, even with the best tenant-landlord relationship, when an affordable possibilty can be found with enough research and bought for a good price.

Sure, there are good landlords. But, often there's a very hefty premium for those units which almost justifies taking the plunge and buying, especially if like us, you want to stay put 5-10 years.

Another example of how laws that are tenant-friendly in theory don't work out so well in practice. What Mass. needs are quick, efficient, cost-effective and fair forums for resolving disputes. But we don't have them. So bad landlords and bad tenants get away with quite a lot, unless the wronged party has a lot of spare time and fortitude to fight back. Mostly, inertia wins, and the law doesn't put out much effort to stop it.

So, she should run away. This guy is bad news from the get-go. If she has the fire in her, she could also report the landlord, and the rental agent, for whatever good it does. If she does report him, of course, she can kiss the apartment goodbye.

But there's another approach that puts inertia on her side.

Take the apartment, and write the "cleaning deposit" check. Then, simply deduct that amount from the second month's rent. There's not a blessed thing the landlord can do. He can't evict her, claiming the money she gave him is not for rent, nor for a security deposit, because it's illegal to collect such monies in the first place. He'll be stuck with her til the end of the lease.

We kind of have the same problems. Because of "illegal" lease, we had to give up our dream of becoming homeowners this spring. The cleaning fee or security deposit that your mentioned may not be more than one month's rent, but the penalty for breaking our 1-year lease is enough for paying down payment for a decent condo. So, we waited until the end of lease and found a new place to live in a larger apartment complex.

In our view, most private landlords in Boston area are just despicable. we looked for a dozen places and none of the landlords are negotiable about the moving date and the content of the lease. We would say it is a general problem for people (home sellers, developers, car drivers and ...etc) in Boston area. People here just don't obey any law and law enforcement are almost non-exist. We are sorry for saying that, but that is what we feel after 2-year in Boston. We totally agree with Stacey. Run fast! And move out of state if you can.

There's not enough information here. Did the landlord try to get first, last and security and the cleaning deposit on top of that? If that's the case, then yes, it would be illegal. If they were just asking for the first and security and then a cleaning deposit, then that would be ok because the landlord isn't holding more than 3 month's worth of rent.

As for claiming the cleaning deposit is part of the rent, it depends if the above conditions are met. The landlord could still try and file for an eviction for non payment of rent and then that tenant's name would end up on a list of tenants that were named in court. Landlords can chose to buy these lists when screening for tenants. As for calling them dirty tricks, it's more like ignorance of the law is more likely than a deliberate scam.

Either agree to the fee or not and stick with it, or find some other place. Don't try to renegotiate afterwards, you're in a much stronger position before renting than afterwards.

if illegal to ask clean deposit, then report this landlord to consumer protection division or attorney general.

he262: you are incorrect. It has nothing to do with the amount of money held. Landlords are allowed to ask for only three *kinds* of payments: the first month's rent, the last month's rent, and a security deposit of up to one month's rent. You can't ask for the last two months' rent in lieu of a security deposit, nor can you ask for a two month security deposit in lieu of the last month's rent.

I think the issue given here is that the landlord is asking for this cleaning deposit before moving into the home. The landlord will (supposedly) hold these funds until the tenant decisdes to move but the funds are not going to be deposited into a bank account which is not fair. Any money held for damages or "cleaning" should be held in a MA savings because these funds are considered as security. Since this person is just looking, they should keep looking becasue this landlord seems like a renter beware.

The landlord is only trying to avoid bringing in tenants who do not care for the property. A proud owner wants to take care of their building and would like the tenants to treat the property with respect. If all tenants keep their area clean during their tenancy and upon leaving, then all are happy and the tenant gets their cleaning deposit returned. Not all landlords are evil.

I believe ascribing malice to the Landlord is unfortunate and likely inaccurate. My bet is that s/he was stuck with an unrentable unit due to a prior tenant's mess and is trying to avoid the situation again. I recommend that all Landlords be involved with associations -- such as the Massachusetts Rental Housing Association or Small Property Owners Association -- to understand their responsibilities and rights.

Bill, a cleaning deposit is illegal in Massachusetts. Period, end of story.

This landlord is flagrantly violating the law. Whether it's by intent or out of ignorance doesn't matter much.

Marcus, if it is written in the lease and the tenant knows it, and agree's to it. Then it is legal.

Bill, I'm not arguing with you. Click the link and read the state web site. The law isn't whatever you think. It's whatever the law says.