Teixeira's a money player
In the baseball agent's perfect world, the consummate free agent would have the leverage of past achievement, the promise of youth. He would be tall. He would be strong. He would hit from both sides of the plate, possess Gold Glove credentials. And he would be regarded as a true professional.
| MAZZ'S HOT STOVE SERIES: Continuing today and ending on Nov. 13, the day before free agents can sign with any team, the Globe's Tony Massarotti will tackle an offseason topic of interest to Red Sox fans each day. Check out the schedule below. Shortstop in focus Yankees: Under construction Handicapping the field of potential Manny suitors Top prize: Mark Teixeira Potential Sox trade partners Big-ticket starters and the art of building a bullpen Tony's best- and worst-case offseason scenarios for the Red Sox and Yankees MORE FROM MAZZ: |
Most important, he would be coveted by those who matter most.
Mark Teixeira just completed his sixth major league season in October, when he went 7 for 15 (a .467 average) with four walks for the Los Angeles Angels against the Red Sox in his first career postseason appearance. He will not turn 29 until April. Teixeira is a switch-hitter with a career OPS of .935 from the left side of the plate, .912 from the right. He has won two Gold Gloves at first base and a pair of Silver Slugger Awards.
Over the last six seasons - the length of his career - Teixeira ranks fifth in the major leagues in RBI behind only Alex Rodriguez, David Ortiz, Albert Pujols, and Manny Ramirez. Among those players, only Ramirez is also a free agent, and only the 28-year-old Pujols is also under 30. That leaves Teixeira with the profitable distinction of being both.
"There are very few players in sports who offer a team a franchise face, the completeness of offense, defense, and of being a good teammate - and we have, for the first time, an idea of his ability in postseason play," said agent Scott Boras, who represents Teixeira. "You're talking really about a franchise player."
A sales pitch?
Certainly.
But in this case, all of it also happens to be true.
Not chump change
At the foundation of every negotiation, without exception, rests a fundamental concept: supply and demand. Without the latter, the former is worthless.
In Teixeira's case, demand this offseason could be at an all-time high.
Typically, when a player like Teixeira reaches free agency, the market for him is relatively small for the simple reason that few teams can afford him. Despite their success, the Tampa Bay Rays will not bid for Teixeira's services. Neither will the Florida Marlins. Only those clubs with sizeable resources have the flexibility to invest in someone like Teixeira, whose price this offseason could border on the stratospheric.
So where will that number end up?
Consider this: At the 2007 trading deadline, the Texas Rangers traded Teixeira to the Atlanta Braves after the player (and his agent) rejected what club officials believed was an aggressive, competitive offer to retain him. That package was worth a reported $144 million over eight seasons, an average of precisely $18 million per year. That has led many to believe that Teixeira's asking price this winter could approach a whopping $23 million to $25 million per season, regardless of where his final average salary lands.
One American League executive recently noted that Teixeira has been eyeing this offseason for quite some time, with the intention of becoming one of the highest-paid players in the game. In that way, he has been Boras's ideal client. Teixeira has been traded twice in roughly the last year and a half, all because he wants the right to choose for whom he plays - and for how much. This is his first shot at free agency.
In July, seeking to fortify their lineup for the stretch run, the Angels acquired Teixeira from the Braves for a package including young first baseman Casey Kotchman. The Angels' failure to win the World Series has led to considerable speculation that the club will seek to retain Teixeira despite what could be a fierce and extremely expensive bidding process.
After all, the Angels alone are not in the market for a hitter to anchor the middle of their lineup. Having dealt Ramirez to the Los Angeles Dodgers at the July 31 trading deadline, the Red Sox have had discussions that suggest they will make Teixeira their top priority this off-season. Boston's need comes at a time when the rival New York Yankees missed the postseason for the first time since baseball's last work stoppage (1994) and are moving into a new stadium, all while the Yankees have pared tens of millions from a payroll that can now grow even larger.
Get the picture?
The Angels want Teixeira. The Red Sox want Teixeira. The Yankees want Teixeira.
And they all have money to burn.
"We haven't figured it out yet. Everything he's swinging at, he's hitting," Red Sox manager Terry Francona said of Teixeira during the AL playoffs. "He hit a ball neck-high the other day. We didn't want to let a guy like that start feeling good about himself, and that's exactly what he's doing. He's getting to everything right now."
Including, it seems, to pay dirt.
A good fit
With regard to the Red Sox, in particular, Teixeira seems that rare talent for whom they will make an exception. Although Sox officials placed Ramirez (and his exorbitant contract) on waivers following the 2003 season, they also paid an astonishing $51.11 million merely for the right to negotiate with Daisuke Matsuzaka. Total costs for acquiring Matsuzaka exceeded $103 million during the same winter in which the Sox spent $70 million on outfielder J.D. Drew and an additional $36 million on Julio Lugo.
Now, to borrow a phrase from former Sox GM Lou Gorman, comes the question that every Sox follower asks next:
Where would they put him?
By all accounts, the Sox' primary plan to accommodate Teixeira would involve moving Kevin Youkilis to third base and trading Mike Lowell, who currently has two years (and $25 million remaining) on a three-year, $37.5 million contract. Last offseason, Lowell actually turned down more money from the Philadelphia Phillies, who might again have interest in Lowell depending on how he recovers from hip surgery.
Regardless, this much seems clear: The Red Sox fully and thoroughly intend to explore the possibility of signing Teixeira during an off-season in which Ramirez and pitchers CC Sabathia, Ben Sheets, Derek Lowe and A.J. Burnett are all free agents. For a Sox club that takes great care in assessing risk, Teixeira is a far safer option that any pitcher, and the combination of his age and productivity makes him ideal to fill the salary spot once occupied by Ramirez.
During his career, after all, Teixeira has averaged 151 games per season.
Should the Red Sox succeed, Boston could further solidify a foundation that would allow the franchise an extended run at more world titles. Entering next season, depending on what the Sox do at catcher, right fielder Drew (33) and designated hitter Ortiz (33) would be the only regular Sox position players over the age of 30, and the Red Sox pitching staff, too, would be relatively young and accomplished. All of that only puts greater emphasis on Teixeira, who would give the Sox the kind of lineup centerpiece that Theo Epstein's player development system has yet to truly produce.
Up to now, the only problem is that Mark Teixeira has planned for this as much as the Red Sox.
This article also appeared in this week's OT magazine.
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Where would they put him?
Of course he plays first base, and Kevin Youkilis has to move. So does Youkilis move to third and Mike Lowell get traded? As a certain ESPN football talking head says, "Not so fast, my friend." Why not move Youkilis to left field, keep Lowell, and trade Jason Bay? As much as I like Bay, I think you can get more in a trade for him than you could get for Mike Lowell. The need appears to be catching and middle relief, with a fourth or fifth starter a "nice to have", but not a necessity. Jason Bay, packaged with a prospect, could possibly bring both the catcher and reliever.
Get Teix!!The Yankees need too many other essentials to accomodate their fill.The Sox are basically set with the pitching.That's the Yankees' WOE.The Yanks can be had on this one..The only WINNER here is BORAS,because he's in the drivers seat.But,if Manny is worth (????),then what's the price of Tiex.....Switchitter,great glove,Excellant Neighbor.....What an Infield the Sox could have .....Teix,Pedie,Youk,Lowrie......That leaves me to Lowell.......he has to go,like the song said.....Model citizen too....But the PRIMARY concern should be a Catcher!!...But, the Sox have the monies,too!!....also,maybe Baldelli in relief in OF
Watching Texiera in the ALDS I thought the Red Sox HAD to go get the guy. Imagine an IF with Youk, Pedria and Texiera (all gold glovers) with the Sox young pitching, closer and now power of the order to replace the departed one.
But I've change my tune. He turned down $144 million, so it will take $200 million. Now magine the disruption: Youk, Pedroia and Pablebon will have to wait for long-term contracts making them all more likely to wait until free agency for the biggest bidder. Lowell, a popular guy will be moved or unhappy. The ripple effect could have lasting consequences.
I'm now of the mindset to let him go. One guy never makes a team. Spread the money around by locking up Pedroia, Pabelbon and Youk. Stick one more year with Lowell, a great sign of loyalty for his playing in pain and taking less money to stick around. Put money into at least a couple of relievers and a starter (The two Japanese pitchers make sense, but so does Ben Sheets. Because of his injuries, he'll likely take a two or three year deal and the Sox can afford to take the risk).
Even with all that, you probably have spent about what you would have on Texiera. If you are still willing to spend money, look at a top SS like Furcal. Also make a trade for a catcher (either Benji Molina or one of the Texas trio will work).
This solidies the team, rewards the players you developed, keeps the clubhouse even and close-knit, and leaves some room for a young Lars Anderson to develop into the next all-star.
A no-brainer, a must sign. He is an essential piece sorely needed in their batting order. He is an on base machine. Mike lowell has been outstanding for the sox, but I think the time has come for the sox to move him. If Texiera ends up with the yankees he will be a sox killer, mark my words.
"Teixeira's a money player" This is not grammatically correct.
Easy; convert Youk into a shortstop!!; that way, Texeira can cover 1st and Lowell continue to cover 3rd; all 3 have great at-bats; what an infield that would be:
Texeira at first
Pedroia at 2nd
Youkilis at shortstop
Lowell at 3rd
JD Drew in right
Ellsbury in center
Jason Bay in left
Varitek behind the plate [if retained]
great pitching: Matuzaka, Beckett, Lester, Wakefield, ?Masterson starters
WOW: great prospects for 2009;
Makes the 3-4 punch with Ortiz a horror for opposing pitchers again. No brainer...I'll buy another Bud Lite.
Can Youk play short?
Get real: There is no way Mark Teixeira is going to seriously test waters of the Landsdowne St. Love Canal. The only deal Scott Boras is going to make with the Red Sox this off season is maybe he'll ask Texeira to pretend to be interested in the Red Sox if the Red Sox will pretend to be interested in Derek Lowe. But I doubt Boras can even get him to do that.
hes not skinny enuough..most SS are thin and fast.
I love how you fail to mention his hometown Orioles. Could that have been what he has been holding out for? We'll see.
We'll get him. They want him too badly. Lots of guys and options to shop around.
How many guys like Teixeira are in the league right now? Correct me if I'm wrong, but ... NONE besides him. He is young, hits for power & average, is a switch hitter and hits equally well from both sides, he is a great fielder, a smart base runner, has more walks than strike outs ... if they don't dump the bank on him they are insane, period. They should go 6 years @ 27 per and get it done with. If Manny is worth 20 mil, Tex is worth 30 ... so 27 is a bargain. BTW the stats on Manny's fielding are hilarious ... was one of those 5 tools Boras spoke of garden gnome?
Can we hold the train up here regarding Teixeira. My concern is that this is the next A-Rod (great numbers, little winning). Several of his ex-teammates have said that he looks like an elite player until you see him play everyday and then realize he is a good player. For that amount of money and years, good is not good enough. Frankly, if he asks for more than 5 years, the Sox should walk away.
Hey Buzz- please, please, please, stop suggesting Youk at short.
Youk himself has scoffed at the idea. Take a look at his body. He is not going to be a shortstop ever! He's a corner guy- quick reactions- limited foot speed.
You make the guys suggesting he catch look like Mensa members.
Texeria- nobody will out bid the Yankees on him.
Move Youk to LF? Move Youk to SS? You guys are making these completely asinine recommendations. Learning a new position is way more difficult than you think it is. To stick a body there for a game is one thing, but to expect a Major League baseball player to completely learn a new position is a ridiculous request. Youk came up through the ranks as a 3B and learned 1B. He has gold glove caliber defense at both. Isn't that enough for you people?
Hey buzz - what are you smoking dude - wait the 30 days for the law to take effect - Youk at SS. Hey, I love the guy at the corners, but SS is totally different. I can see Youk in left and package Bay if you had to - but I'd find a way to get Texeira at 1st for 162 games
Just a thought....Is Dontrelle Willis washed up? At 11 million,is he worth it?....27 years young,over 9+ ERA.......was it a bad year...9+ERA .... (Did Varitek have a bad year).....Makes one wonder.He might be the best deal on the market,if there could be a trade.Say,Coco and Lugo?His 6 year stay dresses just under 4.00 ERA.....The Sox have made many,many bad trades.....one more can't hurt.Who knows,just may redeem themselves......just a thought
Moving Youk to short is not going to happen. Please, lets not get carried away here!!
does no one recall that teixeira was a red sox draft pick we could not sign? i could possibly be wrong on this, but i don't think so.
Convert Youk to shortstop?? Put Youk in LF and trade Jason Bay?? I truly hope some of the notions being forth here were merely misguided attempts at humor. Kevis Youkilis is a corner infielder. He's not an outfielder, he's certainly NOT a shortstop and has no desire to play either position. Not to mention he'd be bad at both spots. Yet he was a terrific 1B and solid 3B as well. You see, you have to put guys on the field to play DEFENSE too. This isn't a softball team we're trying to put on the field here. Bay is a solid hitter with the kind of even keeled personality(like Drew) that showed that he could handle producing in a town like Boston in the regular season and in the playoffs. If anyone goes it has to be Lowell
clarification of my previous post, teixeira was a ninth round pick by the sox in 1998 after long being rumored to be their first pick, boras turned down the sox offer after some supposedly dirty tricks by duquette and wayne britton.
If you're constructing a beer league softball team try Youklis @ ss, otherwise get a ss that can field with range and hit @ least average. Tex is a great player but the RS would be trying to put a square peg in a round hole relative to the other personnel on the team. The front office should be intelligent enough to stick to their disciplince and build the team accordingly. Unless a sensible trade can be made of Lowell (doubtful) then concentrate on the 3 areas of need, ss, c, and middle relief.
How quickly the masses forget the howling protests last year to keep Lowell.
Pedroia came up as a SS, he could slide take over there the most easily.
Lowell/Yook would fill out 2nd/3rd. Doesn't really matter which does what.
Any good infielder can play second base well enough.
I do think that Texeria is probably too much cash in the end though. Catching is the critical spot right now, followed by SS. If we can find guys that can consistently hit .270+ at those spots, we'll be plenty OK offensively.
wow
can youk play short
thats just stupidity
I have been over and over this in my head, and while Texiera seems like a worthy investment and also seems like a nice guy, but if we get Lowell back I would rather have our infield of mostly gold glove winners at those positions. I feel like if we are to dwell on any of the free agents out there, well, probably Derek Lowe or, yes I know, Ben Sheets. I worry about our big three and the fact that Jon Lester probably threw more innings than he had to because of Beckett's injuries, Dice K's dl ride (which he probably should take every year), and Bucholtz's unravelling. And then when our bullpen had the holes of Hansen and those other guys. And then I keep thinking, I know when people think eek about Jason Varitek possibly leaving that Kevin Cash can't do the job, but, well, what about David Ross? I mean we just need a stop gap until the guy with the Spinners or the guy with Portland become a little more seasoned.
MAZZ GO BACK ON THE BIG SHOW, WEEI! The Globe needs to end this non-sense!
Teixeira is definitely worth A-Rod money more than A-rod is. He would fit in perfectly. The only question is years - I can't see the Sox offering a 10 yr deal but I would not be surprised at 6-8 years @ $25MM.
Youk play short? Are vous out of your gourd? And why the rush to trade Bay? Please focus on sports teams with all kinds of hired in talent and no chemistry! Lowell is a key chemistry guy, a leader. Ditto with Tek. Bay is another good guy, the kind that makes a team a team.
We had one shortstop as a cleanup hitter. He nows in on the bench in LA LA land. One Nomar was enough for me in my Nation life. Go get T-Man and get Youk to third base. It would hurt to lose Mike Lowell. I've never liked a Sox player better than him, but it's in the nature of the game.
A quick summary of this article for those who don't want to waste 5 minutes of their lives reading it: Teixeira is good. Teams want him.
A quick summary of the comments (with my analysis of these comments):
-Keep Lowell and trade Bay (which would be a dumb move)
-Trade Lowell (good move)
-Someone said "Teixeira's a Money Player" is grammatically incorrect (it isn't)
-And finally, move Youk to short (which could be the dumbest suggestion since Theo said, "Hey, let's go after Lugo."
youkilis CANNOT play short and putting one of the best corner infielders in the game in left field doesn't work either. theres only one option to making room for teixeira and thats trading lowell. This is what the line up could possibly be.
1 Pedroia, 2 youk, 3 teix, 4 ortiz, 5 bay, 6 drew, 7 lowrie, 8 elssbury, 9 catcher.
after youk you have a switch hitter in teixeira followed by a left then right handed batter for the rest of the lineup. i highly doubt theres another team with that ability and that same level of talent in a lineup. and if ellsbury can raise his avg and more importlantly his OBP then he can do what he was meant for and leadoff.
Only someone who knows nothing about baseball would suggest trading Jason Bay and moving Youk to left. Just plain stupid!
Youk loves the idea of moving to 3rd, because that's where he's played all his life.
Bay will outproduce a 36 year old Mike Lowell, coming off major hip surgery.
Sign Texiera and sign Bay to an extention. The find a catcher.
End of story.
I would almost rather put Youk at SS or find a way to not deal Lowell. I feel like dealilng Lowell would be a slap in the face to him after our world series MVP in 07 turned down more money to stay with the Sox which is saying a lot.
Scott from San Fran really makes a good point too, do we want to end up like the Marlins? Win it one year then have a fire sale because in a few years theres no way we could pay out huge contracts to Pedroia, Youk, Papelbon, Lester, etc, but then again this is why Theo does what he does. I have faith in him
As for others Bay is going nowhere, I'm so sick of people talking about trading away a guy who is going to hit 30hr 100rbi this year.
I don't think any player is worth over 15 million a year.. too much money around one player that can get hurt or just become "average" over time. I would much rather see the depth and balance the sox have. Look at Manny, Drew, Lowell, Lugo.... big $s for little play time.
Focus on younger players with bigger upside.....
crisp for alexei ramirez , who'll play short (i wish)
lugo , to whoever will take him , for a 4th OF and 7th inning guy
see what you can get for lowell, maybe him and masterson can get a catcher from texas.....?,
and SIGN Texeira for 5 yrs,/ 105 million
= WS title 3....maybe 4...
theo is going to get it done
Daisuke has as good a shot at playing shortstop as Youk does. Not going to happen.
Grow our own.. Mark is not impressive to the extent that we should put up 20 to 25 mil per year . Also trade Varitek.. Wecan't afford his easy out any longer.
I think they should go after Teixeira. He is their kind of player, high on-base percentage, great defense, power hitter, he's 28 years old and he plays a position that generally ages well.
If the Red Sox were to sign Teixeira, they would have a glut of slugger/corner guys, with Kevin Youkilis, Lowell, Ortiz and Teixeira; if the Red Sox were to sign Teixeira, Boston might move Youkilis, Bay to right and J.D. Drew to center, with Jacoby Ellsbury working into the rotation in the way that Coco Crisp did in 2008, through injury and planned rest.
In terms of Youkilis in LF, look at how well he picked up 1B when they moved him there. I see no reason why he wouldn't pick up LF in a similar way.
I know this is a long shot scenario, but if it happens it can really payoff for the Sox.
This is to BAMS, and boblat.....Are you people retarded? Youkelis CANNOT play shortstop! He does not have the range you fucking morons! Hell, Dustin Pedroia didn't have the ability to play shortstop at the major league level, so Boston converted him to be a 2nd baseman-and Pedroia has much better range than Youk. I swear you idiots must be bandwagoners that just started watching after we won in 04' because you morons know nothing about the game at all! And for all you idiots who wanna trade Jason Bay, get off the crack pipe. He's a 30 HR a year guy that will bat around .300 and play solid defense. Boston will trade with the Rangers for Saltamalachia to catch, and they will bring in a reliever via free agency. If they get Texeira (which is maybe a 25% chance) they will move Lowell in a deal paying part of his salary to whomever takes him. They may package Lowell with Cocoa, much the way Lowell was packaged with Beckett when he came from Florida.
Youk at shortstop? Do you have any clue about baseball? This is not a fantasy baseball team, this is real. Youk at short - damn pink hats.
C'mon folks. There is no way Youk could play shortstop effectively. He'd probably cost us 30 runs or more over the course of the season with his lack of range and quickness. Could we stop bringing this up.
Youk at short? Smoke another one pal.
Youk at short's an interesting question. No doubt Youk's got the arm for it, but I wonder about the footwork and range, altho it's not like he'd be playing 2nd base. If a big guy like ARod can play short, why not? On the other hand, I like Scott from San Fran's perspective, as long as Tex ends up in the NL.
How is "Teixeira's a money player" grammatically incorrect?
Teixeira is the subject
's is short for IS, which is the verb.
player is the object
money is the adjective that describes what kind of player he is.
Perhaps the English textbook you are using was written prior to the movie "Swingers" having been released, which marked the point where the word 'money' entered our lexicon with a new connotative usage? The beautiful thing about language is that it is dynamic.
Regardless, it was meant as an entertainment article, not as an example of the kind of English your 10th grade teacher demands on your book reports. People who bitterly nitpick sports articles to try and prove they are smarter than a sportswriter, are annoying and immature.
"Can Youk play short?"
I doubt it. He could probably play left, but would he want to?
way too expensive. Bid him up, but Pass.
Guess I'll be the lone dissenter. I saw him here (Texas) for several years, and he reminds me of A-Rod --he's a cancer. As soon as as whined his way out of Texas, several of his teammates were quick to throw him under the bus for his attitude and general demeanor. He's a great stats guy, but I really don't think he'll be a good fit in Boston. Writers didn't like him, and even the guys in Texas who everyone gets along with didn't dig his act. I'm not sure I ever saw him smile here...he's like the anti-Papi. I . He will not be digging the daily scrutiny from The Nation. Seems like a perfect Yankee-- a mercenary "me" guy. Drive the price through the roof and let teh Yanks have him.
Trading Bay to move Youkilis to left is silly. That means making your team worse at 2 positions defensively. The real solution is alternating the DH among Bay, Youk, Lowell (if healthy), Drew and Teixeira...meaning, yes, cut ties with Ortiz. Can't see him returning to top form. Playoffs were a harbinger of his declining skills. BTW...all of you set on trading Bay, he was most productive Sox batter in playoffs when it counted the most.
It is simple; sign him or finish 3rd in the AL East.
What about Pedroia at short and Youkilis at second?
Have to give the Yankees the advantage on Tex. Compare the billion dollar palace the Yanks are going into compared to dingy, ancient Fenway, though Fenway does have a certain charm. The Sox have to juggle their lineup to fit Tex in, the Yankees are wide open at 1st. If the Yankees really want Tex, no one will be able to outbid them for him with jaw dropping revenue soon to be coming in from the new stadium and tens of millions coming off the payroll. No one knows where Tex would prefer to play. That and other factors beside the money will figure into his decision to at least some extent. Perhaps Tex wants to stay in So. Cal if the Angels make a competitive offer. It'll be interesting to see how it plays out.
big fat mike lowell contract will keep sox from making serious run at teixeira. we all love lowell and we loved the deal after the sox won the series, but ot so much now.
Youk---LF--Not going to happen. SS --- are you kidding me, that is about the stupidest idea of I have heard. He does not have the range or athletic ability.
How bout offering Youk and Bucholtz to Texas for Teagarden or Saltamachia and Michael Young. Or Youk and Bucholtz to the Twins for Mauer. Then sign Texeria.
1st priority should be a catcher and not overpaying for Tek.
YOUKILIS at SHORTSTOP?
Why not just put Papelbon in center field, JD DREW behind the plate, and let Pedroia pitch every fifth day?
Whoever suggested that one should win the "Yogi Berra at Third Base" award.
No Youk cannot play short!
pennstatedad - lowell's skills are in serious decline. the only reason why teh sox signed him s because they figured they'd have riots if they did not. you sign texeira for whatever the asking price is and put him at first and then move youk to third -- it's a no-brainer!
Youk would be a natural at short....to make up for his lack of range he could just use a really big glove! I can't believe Theo and the gang didn't think of that.
More seriously.....the Yanks will end up overpaying for Manny and that's fine...I'd go after him. Trade Lowell, Lugo and Crisp for middle relief, a veteran starter and Saltalamacchia or a catching prospect depending on what happens with our captain. Varitek's a tough call because if you end up signing Teixeira and Papi gets healthy then you figure even if V-tek hits like last year the offense will be more productive...especially if somebody teaches Ellsbury how to work a count and he \improves too. Theo's got his work cut out for him.
Go Sox!
Sox 09 starting lineup could look like the following:
Ellsbury CF
Pedroia 2B
Teixeira 1B
Papi DH
Youkilis 3B
J. Bay LF
JD Drew RF
Varitek C
Lowrie SS
With Cora, Cash, and a 4th outfielder who can pinch run on the bench.
How about trading Ortiz and keep Lowell as DH?
bams go to a grammar site and post . . .
Buzz . . the sox took materson off the starting pitcher roster to make him a bullpen guy -- this is what they need
This would be such a typical dumb move by a big market team. They have an MVP candidate at first who is every bit as much of a "money player" as Texeira. So they move Youk to third where they have last year's post season mvp and another "money player". They need a short stop. They need starting pitching. They need a set up man. They don't need a first baseman. Doesn't this seem a little to similar to Jason Giambi as a free agent five years ago? Theo hasn't made an intelligent decision since he took over as GM and I don't expect him to start now. They'll probably sign him and end up with a $15 Million bench player (Lowell).
Youk at short sounds awesome but I dont know that he has the range to play the position. I have to admit its an interesting concept though. How about Dustin at SS with Youk at 2nd? Can Jasn Bay play SS? Maybe Coco? I hope they keep Coco around. I swear his 2007 season was the best Ive ever seen anybody play CF at Fenway for a whole season. As far as Teixeira goes, I not sure I want the Sox to get him because he's a great player, or to keep the Stankees or Angel from getting him. He demanding sooo much $$$. Id like to see the Sox sign the guys they have to long term deals. If they can do that AND somehow manage Teixeira then lifes even better.
People, STOP suggesting to move Youk to SS! It is NOT GONNA HAPPEN! If they aquire Teixeira (which I hope they do) then it's plain and simple-- Lowell has to go.
Boblat: No he can't.
pennstatedad: Youk does not want to play in the OF. When the idea came up this year, he was very disgruntled and not willing to do it. It's either 1st or 3rd in his mind.
They really do need more protection for Papi. I know he was going through the mental and physical issues of the wrist injury, but I think there's more to it than that. Ortiz needs that big bat behind and Teix is the best option right now. I hope the sox can swing this one. It'd be huge!
I think the wise move would be
Tex at 1st
lowell at 2nd
dustin at short (his original position)
Youk at third (his original postion)
Jed would be the super sub
only weak spot could be lowell's speed defending 2nd but what a poweful attack on opposing pitchers
youk at ss?? hahaha. crack is good. let's re-sign fisk to play c .
Sign Tex and keep Youk.
Youklis = the 21st century Tony Phillips.
Think about it. He's shown that moving around the field doesn't mess with his head. He'd like a way to set himself apart as a truly unique kind of star.
He could spell: Ortiz at DH, Tex at 1B, Lowell at 3B, Bay in LF, and, in some parks, Drew in RF. Moreover, when Francona is willing to shuffle the OF, he could even spell Ellsbury in CF (Bay moves to RF and Drew to CF). In a pinch, Youk could play 3B and Lowell 2B. Heck Youk could probably play a passable 2B.
Keep 'em all fresh and have Youk in the lineup 6 days out of 7. And, obviously, have an amazing bench.
He's going to the Yanks or the Orioles
tex at 1st, youk in right, drew in center, bay in left...trade coco and juan pierre,oops i mean otis nixon, oops again i mean ellsbury .............or i wonder if youk can catch??? he seems adept at various positions, why not ask him??
Is there any chance that Lowell could move to shortstop? Seems to me that, if he's healthy and willing, he has the ability and would be more solid than either Lugo or Lowrie. Were that to happen, Youk moves to third and Teixera plays first. Talk about a productive infield...
But maybe it doesn't work, for reasons I don't know...
Youkilis is not going to play SS...ever. The only way they sign Texeira is if they can trade Lowell's contract & some people in the organization are somehow low on Lars Andersen or they are considering trading him for another piece. Lars is projected for 2010-11 when Lowell will be wrapping up his contract.
actually move Pedria to short he played there before Youk to third Texeira to first have Lowell play second
Can Youk play short? Well, my grandmother can play short....but the question should be "Can Youk play major league shortstop?". Answer...NO
I honestly don't think Theo will go after Tex. As much as I love the guy's playing ability, many people are forgetting about Lars Anderson. He is a 1B in AA and he just simply destroys the ball. We could see him sometime next season. Theo also knows that he is going to have to sign Youk, Pedey, and Papelbon to long term deals sooner or later, so spending that much on Tex will be a burden. The main priority this year is to sure up the catcher position for the short term and long term.
Youk sure doesn't look like a SS, but after seeing him in the postseason play 3B, move well and handle the glove nicely with a good arm, I think he could make it work. I think Lowrie needs another year or two to fill out his skills card before he becomes a 155-game player there. A batting order 2-7 of Pedroia, Ortiz, Tex, Youk, Drew and a healthy Lowell boggles the mind. And if Ellsbury can pick up where he left off in the early part of the postseason . . . Yowza!
Oops, forgot . . . Add Bay to my batting order at, yikes, No. 8!!! A .300, 30-HR, 100-RBI guy at 8th!!!! This is nuts!!! Takes me back to the days when Bosox had Rice, Lynn, Fisk, Yaz, etc. pounding away at the plate.
Teixeira is for sure worth $23-25 million a year to the Sox. He's a money player that would help us win a couple of more championships. Besides his contributions (both O and D), you'd keep him out of our opponents lineup. His bat would also help those hitting in front of and behind him. Plus, we wouldn't have to give up any good prospects to land him (besides a draft pick). It's a no brainer. I'd hate to see the Sox lose out on getting him because we were out bid by a few million; especially to the yankies. Raise the price of Cracker Jacks but get him in a Boston uniform Theo!
youk will never play short. I have heard that youk will go to left drew to center and bay right right field. Ellsbury would be the utility man. This would be a great fit for the redsox as they will have power then speed coming off the bench.
No, Youk cannot play shortstop.
I say put ortiz at first and DH Tex, that way you protect him from injury if you get him
Buzz, Youk cant play SS, dope. I'd have to completely agree with Scott from San Fran. It's going to take a huge contract to sign this guy. Let him sign elsewhere. Pitching wins championships. Everyone seems to want to trade Lowell, he may be getting old, but he's no bum. He was injured last year, not washed up. Can we please cut the '07 World Series MVP some slack?
I don't think Youk is a good 3B.
Some guys will get paid much higher including Paps, Bay, Youk, Pedroia thus the Sox need to save their money for them.
The best prospect in the Sox organization is Lars Anderson the first baseman. When we have much cheaper replacement why should we overpay in FA market?
#3 you called it. I understand Mazz' attraction to Teixera, but I don't buy it. We came sooo close to the WS, despite playing Sept-Oct. with 7 injured starters, because this is the best team in baseball. A $25M per year money guy just won't improve it much, and could cause problems . . . and force us to deal with Boras..
Consider: Ells, Papi, JD, JB, JL, Mike and a revised Catching duo, all healthy, will ADD about 50HR in 2009. A younger, low $$/high OPS Bench of AAA All-Stars and MVP's like Bailey 1b/OF, VanEvery or Carter OF, Thurston IF/OFfrom AAA . . . (look 'em up) will add another 10-15HR. Youk will shoot for 30+ and Dusty for 25, for another 10HR. This team, healthy, will again hit for average, with more power, exceeding 200HR for the first time in years. This IS a powerful lineup and needs little tinkering. Just get them all healthy, and watch errorless Lowrie and Ells become our next Gold Gloves.
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So why would we consider moving Youk, trading Mike, and ticking everyone on the team off who is making a fraction of Tex's wage . . . so he can add another 10HR? Teixera is NOT a need.
A top SP to create a rotation as deep as the Rays, and a good-Gagne replacement to set up Papelbon are true needs. And the catching situation will be addressed and improved because it must.
Youk at SS...that's about the dumbest thing I've read in a long time...friggin pink hat fans at it again
For the love, Youkalis can't play short. 2b isn't going to happen either (despite playing few innings there in '05). Youk and Texeira both have played 1b, 3b, and OF in their respective careers-- but I don't foresee either converting to full-time outfielders.
Youk can't play short. This is so idiotic. Hey, maybe Youk can play catcher !! I myself would like to sign Bay to a long term contract.
Our need for Tex isn't as bad as some other teams since we are already very solid at both 1st and 3rd. If we do sign him, it would obviously be Youk to 3rd (and nowhere else) and to tradeLowell. Although this would make us better, it is a little bit of a slap in the face to Lowell, who has been the ultimate team player. Who took less money just stay with us, then we turn around and get rid of him.
If we were to go that route, a Sox fan should NEVER, EVER, complain again about the Yankees payroll or the greediness and high contracts of baseball players. We should NEVER say anything again about the greed and shrewdness of Scott Boras. Because we would be showing just as much greed by signing a player and then "sticking it" to another player that really liked playing for us. And was an ultimate clubhouse guy.
I am not saying don't sign him. Like I said, we would defintely be better, and baseball has become a business more than a game. But, we would also be assuming the head seat of "who cares about commitment, players, attitudes, etc., etc.," of major league baseball.
Pedroia played short in college. Move him to short, youk to second, Tex on first, Lowell on third. With Bay, Drew, and Ellsbury in the outfield, What a lineup that would be. Look for a catcher, bullpen help and Lowe as a fifth starter.
//Can Youk play short?//
No. Nor can he play left field. (Recall him saying in an interview this year that the injury situation in '06 was so bad, they put him in the outfield. He's HORRIBLE in the OF, and he hates it). Both suggestions are absolutely, positively ludicrous.
Of course the Sox are going to express interest in Tex. They'll express interest in any free agent to drive his price up. They'd be stupid not to.
I always thought that moving Youk to second base and Pedroia to short might be an option. Pedroia is only playing second because Hanley Ramirez was the shortstop of the future. I believe that Youk was a shortstop before the Sox converted him. Can you imagine an infield with Lowell, Pedroia, Youk, and Tex. You could afford a no hit OK field like TEK in your lineup then.
Love to have him, Texeira, but 200 million for one player in an oncoming severe recession, I'm not so sure. We have already experienced the loss of one franchise player this year, Tom Brady. There's truth in the old saying, "don't put all your eggs in one basket". Better to spend the money on catching and a good left handed set-up pitcher, such as George Sherrill, for instance. Javy Lopez is not the answer.
I agree signing Texiera would more than replace the four hole bat we lost with Manny and position us to extend our run of success. It also gives us some protection if the downward trend with Papi continues. That said, in looking at the make-up of the 09' roster/lineup. The major questions are 1). Leadoff; specifically Ellsbury is he ready to be the every day CF and will he be productive enough to warrent being our leadoff hitter?.2). Catcher; re-signing Varitek in my mind is a bandaid not a solution, the time is now for us to get younger and upgrade the position offensively. 3) SS; Lowire showed himself well (field and before hurting his wrist at the plate), was his swoon at the plate soley because of his injured left wrist, or can we expect him to hit as he has at every other level? 4) Ortiz; which Papi shows up next year, the brittle or the beast! 5) 3B; Lowell no garantees that he'll return to health, assuming he will then in my mind. Our lineup will be pretty deep. CF Ellsbury .280, 50 steals Ideally he would walk enough to get his OBP in the upper .370s 2B Pedrioa, .300 20 Hrs - 80 RBI 20 steals. DH Ortiz .270 35 120, 1B Youklis .300 25 120, RF Drew .280 20 90 LF Bay 290 35 110 3B Lowell .280 20 90 C_ _ _ _ _ _ _ 275 15 75 SS Lowrie 290 15 75 with 50 doubles...That's a failry deep lineup. Adding Texiera and subtracting Lowell would be a solid move as the article suggests. Frankly if we can upgrade the catchers spot or Varitek can return to a semblance of his former self at the plate. the accumlative effect (Keeping Lowell) would almost be a wash...The bench right now with Crisp, Lugo & Cash is solid. Adding a player like Kotsay (lefthanded bat that can play all three OF positions & 1B) would be ideal.
Yanks will sign him. They're prepared to pull out all the stops at this point.
While I love Texeira, I really would like to keep that spot "open" for Lars Anderson. We haven't had a young power-hitter in a long long time. I guess they could always sign Tex, and send Lars off like they did with Hanley.
Absolutely idiotic to sign Teixeria. Let's completely change a team that went to the 7th game of the ALCS.
Youk's just as good a player right now and Lowell is UNTRADEABLE. Let's move Youk to SS. WHAT?????
Invest in pitching and tweak a championship roster that will have a healthy Papi and Lowell for '09.
what woud make you think Youk is in enough shape to play SS???? are you kidding me?? why not re-sign varitek, put him in CF and have him hit leadoff? or bring back Schilling and pay him 16 million to run suicides up to the pesky pole and back every home game?
I think a player like Texeria is a must. But to trade Lowell would be a huge mistake . The man is a pure professional and a great player on the feild and off . I see Pedroia was the shortstop at Arizona in college and in the Red Sox minors. With the addition of Tex at first Youk at third move Pedroia to short and move Mikey to 2nd base.Cora is a free agent I believe , leaving Lowrie as the fifth infielder.The out field should be set with Bay a great pickup and Crisp in center and Drew in right and Ellsbury the fourth as he will get plenty of time playing all three positions.with the addition of Texeria you can afford to retain Variteks weak bat for his greacpitching leadership. What a team.
As versatile as Youkilis is, of course he cannot play shortstop.
The Sox will be unable to move a post-surgery Lowell without eating most of his contract - and in these hard economic times, how much jack can we expect John Henry to be willing to eat? A better fit would be to convert Youk into a LF (which he could no doubt handle) and trade Bay (with his modest contract) for catching, bottom of the rotation (4&5), and/or left-handed pitching help.
Teixeira must be signed at any cost ($22-25M / year) by the Red Sox. He's that talented, and what's more, the Yankees truly need him. Let them (Yankees) fight over the free agent pitchers.
Comments, anyone?
Cole Hamels made this guy look sick when he came over from the AL in 2007. If we meet in the WS, you'll see what I mean.
Tex will settle in w/the Yankees. He's a perfect fit and the Yankees can afford to outbid everyone to make sure it happens. The Red Sox threshold # will easily be surpassed by the Bronx brass.
Wanna bet the Sox don't win the bidding war? Alas, this one's a no-brainer.
Red Sox need to get Teixeira. Obtaining Teixeira will strengthen the lineup immensely allowing Ortiz more able to return to what he did when he was healthy and had Manny behind him.
Youk is not a short stop, and I don't think he has the speed or range to be one. I think the Red Sox will have to trade Lowell for some other needs like bullpen help or a catcher.
Biggest problem with all of this is it forces the Sox to trade Lowell - who took the hometown discount to stay and who has been a model citizen. Dumping Lowell, as they did with Bronson Arroyo a few years ago after he took the hometown discount, will make it almost impossible for any player to take the hometown discount again. The Sox will have dumped everybody who gave them a break.
Texiera would be a great addition in the middle of the line-up, but do they really need more offense? Trade Coco for Middle Relief help, get a young catcher and a veteran starter andfI'll take my chances for the '09 Pennant.
One option for Lowell would be to get him some time at 1B to be more versatile and have him play the backup role that Casey played - assuming they couldn't get something good in return for trade and considering the money they'd have to eat on his contract. He'd be expensive in that role, but it would be good to give some guys a blow and you never know when injuries can come up, as they did this year.
I think Bay is the kind of player the Sox want to keep - another good ballplayer that shows up and plays every day and puts up good numbers.
Youk! to LF??? pennstatedad, that's crazy talk! We saw him in left in '06 and he looked pretty bad. He's best at 1B or 3B--leave him there.
And don't trade Youk!!
Another option would be for the Sox to trade Youkilis, Elsbury and Lester to the Yankees for Cano and Cabrera. And while we're at it, let's throw in Bowden.
Just keep in mind when it comes to strictly money, and if the Yankees really want him there is no way the Red Sox will sign him. Theo said it himself "we cannot compete with the Yankees dollar for dollar". If they want him they will offer the most and get him.
The sox should sign Texiera, since they now have ample money with Manny's contract gone. Then they should have him play first Youk third and then take a run at one of texas's catchers, and pick up relief/4-5 starter with Lowell Coco Lugo and prospects as trade bait. The sox would then have a stacked infeild locked up for the next few years, a solid outfeild, one of the best starting rotations in the league, and one of the best defenses. To me this is a no brainer.
What about lowell at ss? I know his hip may limit range, but i am struggling for ways to keep youk and lowell as everyday players and accomodate tex. The only problem with tex is there is no where to put him in the field. in the batting order he would replace manny, and make ortiz impossible to pitch around. but In the field he doesnt fit. Youk is a gold glover at first so why make him move. Lowell is a great rbi guy, excellent at 3rd and stayed at boston even though he coulda made more money elsewhere. So if lowell can't play ss (i doubt he can) i think the sox should save their money with tex and go after some pitching. Sorry but i can't see it playing out any other way.
Trade Youk. Bring in Teixeira or Matt Holliday
Folks, we need another starter.The Yankees made the mistake of thinking they could make it with rookie pitchers last year. Bad move. Texiera would be great but we beat him and the Angels in the first round. We can put a good out a solid team, defensively and offensively but pitching can and should be improved upon. Byrd was a stop gap measure but we need more than that. And Wake could lose it overnight.You have heard it before," You can never have enought pitching."
If Youk can play SS than i am sure he can catch. doesn't he know the strike zone better than anyone??
Stop talking about Youk at shortstop. Everyone stop. Right now. Stop.
How about DH tandem of Lowell and Papi? Can Jed play second to give Pedroia a night off?
In the grand scheme of things paying Teix will hinder the Sox for years to come i.e. signing the "big three" to long term contracts. The entire argument becomes moot if the Yankees want Teix they will get him, tho' I must confess having an A-Rod clone in the middle of the batting order would be fantastic, and he's only 28!
Scott from SF nails it.
Lowell was having a very good season prior to getting hurt and as usual, playing a solid third base. He took less money to stay with us in Boston..... not the best message to send to the rest of the team.
Texiera is good player in a lot of aspects, but he's not great. Well, not Manny great at least. He not the best hitter or fielder at his position, but he'll be paid like one. Texiera is a mercenary and that's a fact. A guy who has waited, not patiently mind you, for his day in the free agency market. He plays for the dollar and he'll get it, play well, but never really truly be a part of this team. I like Texiera, you'd have to nuts not to, but is he really a Boston Red Sox player? This could be our left turn to becoming what the Yankees are and trying to run away from (at least Cashman), being a soulless collection of players who are out for nothing more than their stats.
I think Scott from San Fran has it right. Much as I salivate over the idea of Tex in the middle of the Sox order, it seems unlikely that the Sox will break the bank for one player, even this one. If the Sox outbid LA and NYC, it will mean they've committed such astronomical money to this player that it will have a negative impact on their ability to sign the raft of young Sox stars who will reach free agency soon, and shipping a Mike Lowell out of town one year after he took a shorter contract at fewer dollars for the privilege of remaining a Red Sox strikes me as a chilling move. Then again--who knows what deals may be struck behind the curtain, between the ever wily Scott Boras, his several Sox and Sox-bound clients, and the brain trust of the Sox!
I have to agree with Scott from SF. The red sox have built a team of young relatively cheap players from their farm system, (pedroia, youk, papelbon, ellsbury) it would be sending a horrible message to them who make peanuts compared to the 20+ million tex is gonna make. I wouldlove to see him batting behind ortiz, but it is just not feasible. Keep the lineup the way it is until lowell's contract is up. By that time Lars Anderson will be ready for the bigs and youk will move over to third. Spending loads of cash on big name free agents hasnt worked for the yankees so why should the sox do it. An injury ravaged team was one game away from the WS this year. I dont think we need a guy like tex in the lineup to get it done. I do think the sox should enter the bidding just to raise his price for the yankees to hand-cuff them in this free agent market.
After how we slighted him after high school, doubt he would want to come here with the money being equal to laa, nyy, bal, even wsh
Obviously Youk ain't Playing short.
Obviously whoever wrote that spits shit out of their mouth before thinking. I gotta tell you - I like the sound of Texiera in the line up. It puts something much needed back into the line up since Manny went to LA. You would get that great 3,4 back if Papi, works out, has a good off season, and comes back tearin' it up.
come one T-Rex!!!!!!
Boston want you!!!
Let's find out if Lowell's injury and surgery is much riskier than is being advertised. The word career threatening has been mentioned with Lowell;s injury. Besides, there are no free agents in the next two years who can approach Tex. Bay wants an extension - say 11-12 per year and then you have a young balanced core in place. Also, between Drew Lowell Ortiz -- they might miss enough games to need a whole player.....Youk can move around ----------even if youi cannot trade Lowell......who will be traded if they sign Tex
Facts: No one can match PapI as a hitter when he is healthy. I think both he and Lowell are professionals and will both work to get themselves in great shape. It is hard to do that during the season when the Sox needed them to play even when they was not at their best. Lowell is better than Youk at third even though Youk is a very good third basemen. He was a golden glove at first base in 2007. Pitching is still key to any good team and we got that to keep us competitive. Let's at least gove give Papi and Lowell a chance. Deals are sometimes are ones that are not made. You also will drive up other player"s contracts on a team ikf you get outrageous
As good at Texiera is, don't mortgage the team just for him. The Sox have a lot of young talent making less then $1 mill a year. Their time for a big deal is fast approaching. What about trading Ortiz for a good SS or pitching and move Lowell to DH while we are throwing around crazy ideas.
Looking ahead to the future. Get rid of Drew (Trade). Move Bay to RF. Youk to 3B. Lars Anderson in LF. (I'm pretty sure he can play both OF and 1B), and if he's as good as they say he'll be, we'll have an All Star OF in 3 years. Trade Lowell. Trade Coco. Trade Lugo. (from this we can get a young catcher, prospect(s), a reliever) Sign Teix for 200 million if thats what it takes. Make sure to resign Youk, Paps, and Pedroia to longterm deals. As for pitching. Our depth in the minor leagues at SP (maybe sign a 4th or 5th starter next year) is more than adequate. Looking toward the Japanese market could also be another option. Sign a proven veteran catcher (not necessarily Vtek because he wants way too much money unless you can get him relatively cheap for what Boras is asking for him which is rediculous). Now, look at the roster we'd have come 2011 season. (OF Anderson, Ellsbury, Bay 3B Youk SS Lowrie 2B Pedroia 1B Teix DH Papi C Salty? SPs Beckett, Dice-K, Lester, (Bowden, Buckholtz, Masterson). Yah....