Trade compensation analysis

thanks Mike, you made me feel better. This year is a BIG draft for them though. Lots of holes to fill on defense!!

You're way off Mike.....Yeah...then wait for the 3rd next year....a 2nd rounder is not enough considering that Cassell is our starting QB right now.

Not buying it. There's collusion...

lucid analysis, mike. people need to take a step back and take a deep breath.

how much leverage does a team have with two QBs counting for $29.4 against the cap? plus, the patriots got the 35th pick. maybe it's time to get over the psychological difference we put on 1st vs. 2nd rd, when that pick is 3 off from being a first-rounder -- and will let the patriots pay that player less (less overall risk long-term)

This is essentially the comment I made against an earlier article (minus the 3rd round compensation in 2010 -- forgot about that). You got to think that BB couldn't get anything higher for Cassel -- else why wouldn't he have traded with the higher bidder? There wasn't one. The market is what it is (or now was) for Cassel. You've got to compare the deal we got with the situation we would have had had we not franchised Cassel.

Mike, Thanks for he constant updates and rational analysis. The Pats got a good draft pick that will allow them to solidify their defense without breaking the bank. With their new found cap space they will be able to tie down Wilfork, Seymour, and Mankins. Who knows they may even grab a FA corner with some spare change.

its still an awful deal.. we shouldnt have added Vrabal to sweeten the dea

Cassel alone for a 2'nd rd pick maybe but Varbel too, no way! Keep drinking the Pat's koolaide MR

Still, I gotta think you could have gotten the 2nd rounder for Cassel alone. I am stunned that Vrabel had to be added to mke the deal work. Any chance that the Pats wanted Vrabel to part of the deal??

Mike, I'm just surprised other teams out there (namely the Bucs, Vikings, 49ers) didn't offer something better. I would expect a 1st/2nd rounder this year and a 2nd/3rd rounder next near to be fair compensation for this trade. The fact the Chiefs were able to do it without giving up a 2nd/3rd rounder next year is surprising to me, but the deal is still a good one for the Patriots. The teams who didn't trump this offer from the Chiefs are the real losers in this deal.

Pick 34 is a good value pick. The organization also has San Diego's second-rounder as well as its own. Some real opportunities there for cap-friendly prospects. I see this as a good deal even though the loss of Vrabel hurts to see a fan.

While better than nothing, the trade benefited the Chiefs more than the Patriots. I would have liked to have seen a more fair deal. Oh, well.
At least we now know.

Reiss said "In the end, the feeling here is that the Patriots turned a 2005 seventh-round draft choice -- a player many felt would be cut at the end of training camp (me included) -- into a valuable 2009 second-round pick."

Thank you, Mike, for being the voice of reason. I've read comments that the Patriots were "hosed" by Pioli but what most seem to have forgotten is that Cassell was a seventh round pick. We now have four picks in the top 60 along with now having cap space of 20+ million. Sign Wilfork NOW! :-)

Mike,

I agree mostly with you but are we certain Detroit was not willing to give a 2nd for Cassel? One pick higher and NO Vrabel. They need a starter and have the money. They would have also been able to keep both of their 1st round picks to help in their many areas of need.

It would be interesting to hear not from BB but from other GM's. What do we think if say Detroits GM comes out and says they never contacted us or didn't offer us a similar deal?

Maybe thePatriots would only make such a swet deal with BB's long time friend?

Hooey.

I don't buy it.

I don't buy that the Pats were willing to trade their defensive captain in order to move a top 10 QB for a 2nd round pick.

(Thanks for the reporting though)

Wow.... Reiss I have to disagree? This trade is far from solid, it SUCKS. There was no way Kansas City could have gotten someone as good as Cassell with the 34th overall pick. The Pats either made a huge mistake a) putting the Franchise Tag on Cassell in the first place or b) making this brutal trade.

I don't understand how the Vrabel trade was announced yesterday... but the Cassel part was announced today... but no additional compensation for the Pats today?

Mike;
That's all true. You can't tell me they got some major holes at linebacker and cornerback to fill. The Patriots draft history has not been that great over the past 4 years.

Yes, they got Jerod Mayo. At #10 in thd draft he better be good.
I too wanted to dump Cassell at the end of pre season.
Still not sure why Vrabel had to be thrown into the mix. Keeping him 1 more year .could

Mission accomplished. Now bring home the bacon in the draft.

Great deal - also opens tons of cap space to sign FAs for the defense!

Pioli v. Belichick, 2-1......................Not a good trade at all. Cassel for 34th I can live with but also Vrabel, I cant. I guess maybe we have something else in mind. 4 picks in the first 2 rounds, I guess with the cleared-up cap room Pats can sign more fa and all draft picks.

Trade Brady keep Castle, a quaterback that can read, pass and RUN!?, and all this this in his first year at starting. Now I am afraid to see what happens as he gets better.

Very well said Mr Reiss!! Great analysis

Even if it's the best we could have gotten under the circumstances, it's still a big disappointment to me.

The Chiefs get a great deal because they are the only team to recognize their need for someone like Cassel. They were able to drive a hard bargain because Minn, Car, and TB were too stupid to make a serious bid for him.

How often do you get two starting players, including a young QB, for just one 2nd round pick??

This frees up moves to do whatever they want. They have cap space, they have picks, they have complete and total flexibility. Excellent move.

People need to understand that the dealing is not over yet, and ask themselves what the value is for the #34 pick in this year's draft.

The answer? The #34 pick can be parlayed into a 2010 1st and 3rd.

Mike:

This deal was as good as they were going to get. Plus, the $18 million in cap room means they can go to work on making Wilfork happy, addressing some O-line positions and reloading the defense with younger and cap friendly players. They can also afford to make an impact signing if they so choose. They will have 4 out of the top 57 players to pick from plus 2-3rd rounders to work with for developmental opportunities. And, NE is a home for wayward veterans.

Foul; collusion...
Fire the new personnel staff!!!

so now the patriots have 3 out of the first 46 picks? Good position to be in considering the quality of the draft and their additional cap space

Let's remember that the Patriot's success with second round picks has been spotty at best. Over the last six drafts, the Patriots had five second round picks - Terrence Wheatly, Chad Jackson, Marquis Hill, Eugene Wilson and Bethel Johnson - not exactly a group heading for the Hall of Fame. As a long-time Patriots fan, I would not trade Mike Vrabel, let alone Matt Cassel, for the whole buch of them. This was all about reducing the salary cap pressure, but the team never would have faced serious cap pressure in the first place if it had not franchised Cassel..

mike
How much cap room do the pats have now ($20m?)? when does it free up (monday?)? who are the targets? How much must be reserved for all the draft picks?

DM

Hey Mike,

Any chance that there are more pieces to the puzzle? Do you think the cheifs may throw in a fourth or fifth rounder? Or a pick for next year? Maybe some wishful thinking but how about a certain veteran tight end looking for a ring? Thanks Mike!

Mike, there's something else to think about. This may have also strengthened the Patriots position within the conference. Denver and McDaniels and Pioli and KC are both AFC West teams that - with this trade - will be beating the snot out of each other for years to come. And making life difficult for San Diego also. Unless one team becomes really dominant they all could be physically weakened as the season progresses.

I would like to have seen the Patriots get another lower round pick in either 2009 or 2010 in addition to what they got, but this isn't the disaster that some think.

Mike Reese, you seam like a nice guy, and you lay out some reasonable points as to why this is a gooD deal for the Pats, but until I here what FOX news says, THAN IM UNHAPPY WITH THE TRADE. You present facts, but since facts have a well known librul bias, and since this is the Globe, well, you can UNDERSTAND my ignorance. Its two bad that Socilaism is taking over every PART of the world, even my NFL.

Mike, I assume that your insider access in Foxboro is stopping you from telling the truth about how you really feel. One pick for Cassel AND Vrabel, who's essentially a throw-in? There HAD to be better offers out there. No conditional picks, or mid-rounders for Vrabel? You can't honestly believe that the Pats maximized Cassel's value here.

Take off your FOB (Friend of Bill) hat for a second and tell us how you really feel. As it's been mentioned on other blogs, AJ Feeley and Daunte Culpepper were traded for second-round picks in the past.

This also frees up salary cap space to address Wilfork and the others. The high second rounder is great for someone astute like Belichick. Good for the Chief, good for the Patriots.

Glad the Cassel drama is over too.

Hi Mike, I have to counter your three points, 1) How can teams not need a proven quality QB? That's the most important position. 2) Teams can afford it by creating a long multi-year deal that will pro-rate the signing bonus. Just look at the mega deals done by the Redskins. 3) Teams can be creative with draft picks by using those from future years. I think if a team wanted him, they would have been creative to make it happen. I think the other GM's knew that Pioli and BB had an under the table agreement so that's why no other teams wasted their time bidding for Cassel. BB's doing a favor for his close friend Pioli.

Cassel was traded under the franchise tag. Could there be additional compensation, draft day dealif/when Cassel signs a long term deal? The 34th pick is a valuable pick, player signs 4 years for 4 mill(NFL Network). Thats where the WR's are supposed to slide.Either way I think it accomplishes what both Belichick & Pioli wanted for their teams. Wouldn't want to see another Lawyer Milloy saga over Vrabel's contract.

For years we've all been saying the Pats need to get younger and faster, especially on D. Well, now they have 4 of the first 55 or so picks in the draft, right? I love Vrabel as much as everyone else and hate to see him go, but it was going to happen eventually anyway. I'm excited for the draft and let's see what happens with free agency and hope Tom comes back 100%.

I don't think it was solid. Vrabel alone was a 3rd rounder at least. Cassel should have been a 1st or 2nd alone. Together, for the 2nd rounder is a rip off.

Belichick got fleeced by his protoge.

I take issue with the comment "it's all about market conditions". We never let the market develop. To make this move on the opening day of free agency smacks of desperation. Wilfork's extension could have waited until closer to the draft. I'm certain that BB has additional moves planned but when looking at other quarterback trades, most notably Schaub this deal looks out of whack. I don't see an impact player on defense that we could add with the cap space that makes sense (Recognizing Peppers is Franchised and would have to be a trade). As for offense with TE and RB addressed we don't have any notable needs to fill (3rd WR can be filled internally, through the draft, or inexpensively in FA). Only time will tell but dissatisfaction is appropriate for now.

"Not every team...."

You don't need every team to be interested. All it takes is ONE to drive up the price.

That's it?

Judging from the lower than expected compensation received, I have to believe that no other team was willing to offer a first round pick for Matt. Bacause of Matt's status as a franchised unrestricted free agent, the Pats' leverage in any deal was greatly reduced. Every other team knew that the Pats had to free up their cap and trade him.

When Matt Schaub was traded, if I'm not mistaken, he was a restricted free agent. So, the Atlanta Falcons did not have to commit such a large amount of cap space to keep Schaub. Too bad Cassel was in his free agency year.

Mike, are you reporting that the Pats sent Vrabel AND Cassel to KC and got back the 2nd round pick in return for BOTH? I'm confused....

mike, I am a huge fan of yours but, I couldnt disagree more, you must be absolutley kidding me if you truly believe this is a good deal. a second round pick thats is grand larceny dont give me that econimic garabge either. thats a joke

I don't agree...if all you got was a 2nd round pick for him, then there was no need to let go of Vrabel...

No comments?? I'm happy with what we got. And I'm happy for Vrabel and Cassel to be going to a place passionate about football. Good luck to both of them.

With 3 second rounders...and all the depth at linebacking this year...I guess we'll see what happens..

Good analysis Reiss. If this was the best offer out there what were the Patriots supposed to do, hold on to a $14.5M backup QB when the team has so many other uses for that cap space? Obviously I would've rather seen a 1st rounder come back as compensation but the market dictates the value of every player so if nobody is willing to offer a 1st round pick for Cassel then he's not worth a 1st round pick unfortunately. We can't compare this trade with those made in previous years (like the Matt Schaub trade) because the number of potential trade partners, the fact that the Patriots had very little leverage given Cassel's cap hit, and the state of the economy all factor in to the equation.

A solid trade would have been #34 this year and the Chiefs 2nd rounder next year. This trade is a joke. They Patriots have not drafted a impact player on defense in the last 5 years other than Wilfork and Mayo, the rest of the picks are JAG's. The Defense used to be hardnosed and intimidating. They have not been that way now in 3 plus seasons. Pioli is laughing at how Nic Caserio is a clueless mime and just loves the fact he got a starting QB and LB for next to nothing. Now their OLB consist of Eric "look at Dallas run by me" Alexander and Pierre Woods. Where will the pass rush come from. People forget this defense gave up the MOST TD's in the NFL last year. Yikes!!!

No, seriously. That's it?

Mike if the market had not developed for Cassell, as you state, then why pull the trigger so soon? They could have held on to him to see what other teams got out of the draft and traded him at a later date. They didn't need to make this deal today.
What happens if Brady is not ready to go next season? I disagree with you - this is not a SOLID DEAL for the Patriots. No way! This is a GREAT deal for the Chiefs.

Watch all the local media guys line up to kiss Belichick's ring. Vrabel and Cassel for a single pick? Really weak!! Don Banks has it right.

If the Pats don't sign some big time free agents with the 20 million bucks they traded away, then it would be a disaster in my opinion.

Bellichick blows a cross-country kiss to Pioli.

Should have been able to get an '09 3rd Rounder for Vrabel alone(!)

The notion of cap space is laughable, it is cap money that the pats created by franchising Cassel in the first place. Weak deal. Wink-wink deal with the expectation of favorable terms and reciprocity next time... blah.

You're kidding. What spin. Cassel is no longer a 7th round pick. He's a 27 yo starting NFL QB with a realtively high rating and several teams needed a QB. The Schaub trade netted two 2s. If they are not clearing cap room to make further moves, they got shortchanged.

Why can't we get a Smart player personnel guy like that Pioli

This deal is the best thhe Pats can do. We don't want to overpay for a top ten draft pick and we free up cap space to pay Big Vince, Logan and (hopefully) Neal as well. The 34th pick is where there is real value and we can get some help for the defence.

I'm thrilled to have 5 picks in the first 89, my Pro Bowl QB back and healthy, and cap room to go out and load up a struggling and aging defense, but I must wonder if this is enough?? Albeit from Jerry Jones, WR Roy Williams was swapped for a first, and third essentially just this past season. Yet we trade a 2007 Pro Bowl LB, and a starting NFL QB for just a second. In Bill We Trust (except in Super Bowls when the ball is on the 48 with an upcoming 4th and 13 and a chance to put 3 up) but I must wonder if we could have gotten more in return. Perhaps Tony Gonzalez thrown in would have made me feel better.

I can't understand why they couldn't get a 5th or 6th rounder in 2010 in addition to the 2nd rounder this year. At least we could have required Damon Huard (former Pats QB) as additional compensation. He's probably 3rd on KC's depth chart, but would have been the perfect backup for Brady until O'Connell is ready.

Jingle and Douglas P., the Pats couldn't afford to let the market develop any longer. Free agency is upon us and the Pats were handicapped by Cassel. Now they have the cap space to be players if FA if they choose to.

i though that this was a bad trade at first, but clearing my mind and thinking this straight, it could be a good thing...we have to see the big picture here...and think about the future....i mean, FOUR draft picks in the first 2 rounds....that's how you built a team...

PANIC!!!! PANIC!!!!

Just shows that Pioli was the real brains in the Patriots trade decisions in the past.

You people realize the Pats just cleared over 18 million on this year's cap right? And the team had some cap space to begin with since they didn't spend to the cap last year and the cap went up from around 115 to 123. They need this money to sign players they have and go after some mid-level guys to fill other voids. The offense is now set, we should see some defensive moves soon.

People you are all crazy... The 34th pick in the draft for nothing.... Brady is healthy and you now have the 23, 34, 47, 58 picks to really help the defense. To think that you could get anything for Vrabel is nuts, not in this NFL as many players better were just cut... Deangelo Hall, Dockery, Dawkins ect...

Just what they need to fix the defense... another stuf LB and DB

Vrabel, AND Cassel for a second-round draft choice??? Has Pioli kidnapped Belichick's dog and held him for ransom? This trade sucks.

Mike, your analysis of this trade is spot on. Unfortunately, most fans (derived from fanatical, mind you) will react to this trade in a negative light. Ultimately, the full impact of this trade won't be known until we find out what the Patriot's due with their 4 first day draft choices and the 18+ million in salary cap space that this trade has now created.

Now they've freed up all of that Cassel cap space and can go after the 3 defensive free agent signings on D that they seek in 09: 1 LB + 1 CB + 1 SS.

Do the Pats recieve a better count against the salary cap by trading Vrabel as opposed to just releasing him? It seems the Patriots did Mike Vrabel a thanks for all you did for us favor because he will recieve his full contract including $1.000.000 roster bonus from Pioli and the Chiefs..I would think Vrabel wouldn't get as much as his original Pats contract on the free agent market.. In addition, by trading Vrabel to KC, Pats control where he ends up. I would not want to face a prideful Mike Vrabel twice a year if he signed with a AFC East team.

nuts... !! a 2nd-rounder for cassel alone, okay... but vrabel rated at least a 4th as well... or they could have kept him and let him walk... did they even call detroit... ? could it be pioli was the brains all along... ?

I hate this trade, not enough...and the Pats have not been iron clad in their drafts lately, Mayo not withstanding, if this pick becomes Eugene Chung or Pat Harlow or Kenneth Sims, or more recently Maroney or even Hobbs then this trade sucks. We'd be better off having Vrabel teach some 4th or 5th rounder how to play the game and act in the locker room AND does Moss, Taylor start to revert back to pre-Pats days without Vrabel and maybe Bruschi?...the secondary still sucks and Bruschi is now even older, I get why you trade Cassel and even Vrabel for cap space but it was not enough in return...need a proven player and they dont have it. Is Pioli the genius here and not the other way around?

By Mike's reasoning the trade the Paiders made with the Patriots where Moss came here for a 4th rnd draft pick was a good trade for the Raiders because that's what the market was for Moss at the time. If this is all the Pats could get for those two players then they did something wrong to put themselves in a postion where that's all they could get, just like the Raiders did. It was highway robbery getting Moss for a 4th rounder & this deal here is highway robbery for the Chiefs.

I thought the Haynesworth deal was dumb. There simply has to be more to this. Seriously, this isn't baseball. You can trade draft picks. You can restructure contracts. You can use a lot more in a trade situation. I have to agree that a 2nd round pick for Cassel is about right but for Cassel AND Vrabel, even if Vrabel's contract expires after the season, that's still a lot of BS the Pats want us fans to swallow. They should have also gotten a conditional 2010 pick in the deal at least.

Pats get a high 2nd rnd pick for an aging veteran and a guy they almost cut last preseason. Can't wait for draft day to watch the wheelin and dealin.

Cap room is more important now...you can go after a Shawn Springs and a Leigh Bodden now rather then the Fernando Bryant signings after June. Lots of linebackers in this draft and 2nd round choices do not cost as much so you can re-sign Wilfolk and Logan Mankins. Too little sure...but now you can re-stock your secondary and get younger at linebacker.

Cassell for the 34th would be ok. Including Vrabel is outrageous.

Obviously, there are/were no good offers for Cassel. And, obviously there were no good offer for Vrabel. You can't debate what the market was telling the Patriots. By packaging the two players, they were able to get something good in return. There shouldn't even be a debate as to whether it's a good deal, unless you think the Patriots should have kept Cassel. To argue against it, one would have to know that a better player/pick was being offered, and that's doubtful.

What's lost in the shuffle is there is a very likely chance the Pats might have outright cut Vrabel at his current salary. At his age/price, his straight-up trade value was likely very low (5th at best), so tossing him in as window-dressing in the Cassel trade was a smart move.

So much for a blockbuster trade! Solid deal for the Pats? Sounds like the only one that made a good deal was KC. Talk about a HUGE disappointment. All the Pats are left with are even more holes to fill.....

Mike I always respected your opinion on football comings and goings until this. You are seriously misguided if you think that we could not have gotten ride of Cassel alone for a 2nd round pick and then traded vrabel for at least a 4th rounder or kept him and still dumped 14 million in cap space... Seriously misguided. This trade is an absolute sham.

As I see it, the Pats freed up as much as $18+ million (14+4 per article) of cap space. That's room for alot of talent and with the downturn there likely will be bargains in a month or so (see baseball). Also in cap context, trading for #34 (cap cost = couple million?) is possibly better than #'s 1-5 (cap cost 5-10 million) unless there's a really good fit. Ideally, could have gotten a #10-20 but, absent a need for the top 5 type guy (a left tackle this year but Light's signed), #34 is perhaps a better value than 1-5.

There was absolutely collusion! This is NOT a solid deal for the Pats. Are you telling me that NO ONE in the first round were interested in a QB with franchise caliber potential or that they couldn't have made a deal for more than just a second rounder? And Vrabel gets thrown in to boot? That's insane. The Pats just got RAPED by Pioli and the Chiefs.

not great but if that's the best they could do then fine / not terrible for a 7th rnd, backup QB and an older LB / I would rather have kept Vrabel but they need more speed at LB anyway
also, to me, if Brady is hurt the Pats aren't going to win so Cassel wasn't important... he was ok this year at times

I'm not sure why people thought Cassel was worth multiple picks - especially when the Pat's had zero leverage.

I'm glad its over and we should get better defensively quick with our#1 three 2's two 3's (comp for assante) two 4's (comp for gay two fives (comp for wilson) 6 picks in the top 100 players in the country"go BILL BEIICHICK"

There is something more in this trade.. the patriots now have 3 picks in the 2nd round.. 5 picks in the first 3 rounds. Saving money on the cap and stock piling draft picks.. Bill has something BIG up his sleeve. I like it. Cassel did well filling in and the pats would not have gotten this pick for a backup.

Let's all just hope and pray that Brady comes back as strong as ever because the Patriots are going to need to score points big-time otherwise it could be a long, long season. A quote from Tedy on the Patriots defense losing Vrabel:

“We've lost perhaps our best all-around football player. Defense, offense, special teams, Vrabes did it all. His intelligence and on-field adjustments cannot be replaced. This team has just changed immensely.” - Tedy Bruschi

You ain't kidding it has changed, and not for the better unless the Patriots have some deals in the works to beef up the defense. I'm going to remain optimistic that the Patriots are playing chess and are getting set up for future moves that will improve the team.

spin it all you want Mike but this trade was horrible remember Chad Jackson was a high 2nd rounder

jingle_ballz - You may get your answer if/when "the other shoe drops", which I still expect to happen. The only real reason to make the trade sooner rather than later is to free up the cap space to sign a targeted free agent or make another trade. I know a lot of people think the Julius Peppers rumors are just that, and they may very well be, but Belichick now has the ability to trade pick(s) to Carolina for Peppers and presumably sign him to an extension.

I'm just using Peppers as an example because his name has been mentioned but my point is, by making the move now, Belichick can go and get the player he may be targeting...we'll have to wait and see.

Cassell a 7th round pick.Terrible anaysis. Brady was what a 5th round pick. So we should trade Brady a 5th round pick for a 2nd. I would not have traded Vrabel straight up for a 2nd round pick let alone thrown in a starting QB like Cassell.

I would think the Pats would have recieved a little more in the way of compenstation, but we did slash about $18 million of the payroll for 2009. Now there is money availbale for Mankins, and Wilfork as well as an impact free agent or two. We will also have 4 picks in the first two rounds. All in all, this looks like it will work out. I will miss Vrabel however!

VRABEL HAS MINIMAL VALUE. GET IT THROUGH YOUR HEADS PEOPLE. HIS CAP NUMBER DID NOT EQUAL HIS PRODUCTION VALUE. IT WAS EITHER TRADE HIM IN THE DEAL OR CUT HIM AND LET HIM PICK WHERE HE WAS GOING TO PLAY: J-E-T-S

This is a shocker. The only sane conclusion is that the Patriots either: (a) got taken or (b) colluded with Pioli and the Chiefs. The bottom line, instead of viewing this transaction in terms of what the Patriots eventually "got" for their 2005 7th round draft pick, is that the penalty loss-of-draft-pick imposed by the NFL last year ultimately cost the Patriots Mike Vrabel and Matt Cassel.

Drivel from a management shill...How could you not get a first rounder for the pair?

I think this is a terrible trade. I can't believe all we got was a high second round draft pick. Couldn't we have at least swapped a fourth for their third too or even swapped places? Something tells me that if Pioli were still with the Pats he would have never made this trade. I think the Pats panicked.

As long as Cassel was on the books it was severly hampering the Pats chances of getting better in FA market. They probably have other moves in the works being put on hold. Now they can go after a name (OLB), some midlevel replacements (CB,WR) and sign Wilfork, Mankins. Yeah including Vrabel is rough for the fans, but remember veterans can impede the development of youth. At some point you have to bite the bullet, which in Vrabels case would have been next year anyway. When draft picks are included in trades, we can't honestly evaluate untill the player is chosen. If Bradys back strong and the 34th turns into a stud, this will be seen as a coop for a player who could have easily been cut last year.

I guess that writing means you have to kiss butt in order to get access, but the fact remains that the Pats got hosed in this deal.

Cassel is a quality young starting QB. He alone should have yielded a mid first rounder this year and a conditional second next year. Or vice versa. A second this year and a conditional first next year. Add in Vrabel and it should have been a 1, 2, and a 3.

This is Asante Samuel for Terrence Wheatley again...

People please, You wanted to cut Cassell after the 4th exhibition game last year. Yes, Vrabel is a great player but he was the main clog of the WORST defense in football last year. It's time for change and new heroes for this franchise. We only think we deserve more for these two players because they are Patriots. I bet you the rest of the AFC East is not happy we have all these excellent picks and all this cap money for one of the best draft classes in years.

How in the world can can you say a legit starting quarterback and a veteran linebacker are worth ONLY a second round pick!? The Browns just got a second AND a fifth round pick for Kelen Winslow! Now you tell me who got the better deal!

Solid deal? You're crazy Mike! NFLN is reporting that both Tampa and the Detroit were trying to trade for him. A second round pick is a rip off and nothing more than a goodbye kiss to Pioli. We got robbed!!!!

#87 Mark - good point. I hope you are right.

If any other team traded a 34 year old linebacker and a 7th round draft pick with one year of experience for any 2nd round pick, they would be the toast of the town. Just another smooth move in Patriots land.

Also, imagine if the Patriots couldn't afford Vrabel next year and let him walk. The Patriots would look cheap and heartless. At least this way Vrabel gets to be the veteran and still hold connections in KC.

That a boy mike, don't ruffle any feathers! A second round pick, what a joke!

Type your comment here...
This is the beginning of the end for the Patriots - no doubt about it - thankfully we still have the Red Sox, Celtics and Bruins

Quarterback is the most important position on a football team. It's also BY FAR the hardest to project successfully coming out of college. Who knows what Cassel would have done if he'd made the playoffs, but during the regular season, at least, I saw someone who was every bit the player Tom Brady was during that first season, when he took over for Drew Bledsoe. I'm sure life will be easier for you in Foxborough, Mike, but please, tear yourself away from the gravitational pull of Kraft and BB long enough to write something at least SOBER about a bonehead deal like this.

IF - IF - IF!
If my Uncle had TT's - he'd be my Aunt.
IF!

----------------
After all he did for the Pats, in the end all Mike Vrabel was worth was a throw-in to move up from the 3rd to the 2nd round?

You know who else we got with an early 2nd round pick? Chad Jackson. We just traded Vrabel and Cassel for a player on the level of Chad Jackson.

This doesn't even strike me as an arms-length transaction.
-----------------

Joe, #101. Get real man. Mike's analysis is on mark. No one else was going to give the Pats as much as the got. They had 0 cap space. Joe -- will your opinon change if the Pats add Ray Lewis or Julius Peppers or both on Sunday? How will you feel about this deal then? Keep in mind that after potential large free-agency moves the Pats are stacked with Pics and have a healthy Brady who is wayyyyy better than Cassel ever was. Take the blinders off and look to the future. Good thing you are not in charge of Pats personnel...

hey. Can someone give me an update on if the patriots are willing to trade for julius peppers? And if there is any truth to that.

First off, when a team is trading for a draft pick, it's easy to determine which team is making the best offer. Surely if another team had offered a higher pick, the Pats would have taken it. So they received what the market gave them.

Second, if they had let Cassel walk without franchising him, they would have received a compensatory 3rd round pick (which is essentially a high 4th since it occurs after all teams have selected with their regular picks in the 3rd round). So the trade is essentially, Vrabel and a 4th round pick for a high 2nd (almost 1st round) pick. Given Vrabel's age, his value would only have gone down this year. Add the salary cap flexibility this gives the Pats, and I think the deal makes sense.

Score Pioli 7 Belichick 0 - Maybe the wrong person was responsible for the Patriots sucess. - Say goodbye to Super Bowls for awhile.

Great move.
34th pick is actually more valuable than the #3 pick when you consider this is a deep draft and what team these days, really wants to be saddled with the high cost of a top ten pick??
The Pats get a high second round pick for a guy they have no need for, free up space and have an opportunity to get younger (faster) on defense.
Yeah would have been nice to get another mid round pick in 2010, but the deal is now done and Bill has plenty of options heading into free agency and the draft.

Win-win for the Pats and the Chiefs

MR you are way off. It's too bad you have to drink the Kool-Aid to have continuing access to the PATS....cause if you were to dissent BB would just cut you off...no more access. Some much for objective reporting

You know, you folks are right. And I think its time you showed the Krafts and Belichick you mean business. Its time to turn in your tickets, turn off your TV's, log off this comments section and find a more gratifying use of your time. This team has given you nothing for all your devotion, after you ask for so little. Yet they mock you with their incompetence. Frankly, it speaks to your loyalty and values that you haven't stomped away already.

The fact this deal happened in the first days of free agency means Belichick had no intention of shopping Cassel around. He wanted to give Cassel and Vrabel to the Chiefs to help Pioli get off to a good start. Belichick wants Pioli to be successful.

You nay-sayers are hopefully not Pats fans. Your crazy! Get a clue! THEY DID THE BEST THAT THEY COULD.....MIKE R's assessment is 100% on mark. duh....

105 -- Chad Jackson. Nothing like picking an example that strengthens your lousy argument. How about a few other 2nd rounders instead -- Ted Johnson, Lawyer Milloy. What if the Pats got a new one of them? Would it be a good move then? Stop with the negativity crap....don't follow the Pats if your that much of a jerk. You are officially a Raiders fan from now on. Enjoy their great personnel moves!

If the Pats had him signed to long-term reasonable deal they would have gotten more, but the going rate for 1 year of a $14 million unsigned QB is not that high. KC can't afford to franchise him every year, and Cassel can just walk if they don't.

The last time the pats picked in this area they got guys like Merriweather and Watson.

So you're trading Cassell and Vrabel for a Merriweather?
That's insane

Patriot Place is going belly up...the place is empty...so...the Krafts need to save a buck...so this is the result. Expect to see more of this as the Pats shopping Mall plan goes bust.
By the way, Matt Schaub was traded for two second round picks by himself. All of you "In Bill We Trust" guys chew on that one. Notice that coach Bill sends out a press release....doesn't have the stones to even have a conference call. Wouldn't want to actually answer a question....

If the trade is to clear cap room for a sure-thing free agent DB or Julius Peppers then it's a good deal. In a perfect world they should use the pick to undercut the Jets for Lito Sheppard.

I am thinking "cap space". Last I knew the Pats were second to last in cap space. The money for Baker and Taylor had to come from somewhere. The 34th pick is 2 away from being a first rounder....but isn't....thus saving additional cash. With Wilfork , Mankins, et. al, coming due contract wise, the thought at Pats HQ might be the same thought the Chiefs had - If we are going to have to spend money, lets spend it on proven players we know.

As the Vrabel trade was announced yesterday (without particulars) what we really need to know is what that trade was valued at (assume a 4th rounder?) Knowing that will allow us to know the value placed on Cassel, once they added him. Trying to analyze the aggregate doesn't work.

Mike,

Please stop saying they turned a 7th round pick into a 2nd. That logic is so nonsensical, it hurts.

When the Pats get a 3rd round pick as compensation for Asante Samuel are you going to say the Pats turned a 4th round pick from 2002 into a third round pick in 2009 ? No

If the Pats were to trade Tom Brady for a future first round pick, would you say the Pats turned a 2000 6th round pick into a first? NO!

The draft is a crapshoot. But NFL players that are known commodities and have proven that they can plan at a high level in the league (Cassel, Samuel, Brady, etc) are not draft picks anymore.

You make the world dumber by continuing the use of that analogy. PLEASE STOP! The draft positions of these players has nothing to do with this trade.

The Pats traded a proven starting QB, 26 years of age, & a pro-bowl LB , 34 years of age, for a second round pick in 2009.

I heard patriots might get Manny in this deal as well

I've read all the analyses and I guess we'll see what happens. But if Brady isn't 100%, if KC makes it into the playoffs and the Pats don't, this is going to look like the biggest mistake since Deval ordered his new drapes. Teddy B is upset, I'm upset. Bye Vrabel - we loved ya!

If you are a KC Chiefs fan, you have got to be drooling having Scott Pioli as your GM. Pioli, Todd Haley and Chan Gailey could not have dreamed of getting a player with the 34th pick that will make the impact Cassell and Vrabel will bring immediately. The KC QB, Tyler Thigpen, was a work in progress at best. I'm not so sure that Tony Gonzalvez will still want to be traded. Pioli is the man! I hope this is not a harbinger of things to come for us Patriot fans.

Puddleman, Schaub was not a pending FA with a 14M+ salary. Makes a big difference in market value.

No, you're not trading Cassel and Vrabel for a Merriweather. You're trading the rights to a quarterback you don't want to keep (and whose salary is blocking other moves) and a guy who USED to be the Vrabel we knew and loved. What nobody is saying is that if Belichik thought Vrabel was still an OLB who could perform at a really high level, he wouldn't trade him. So Vrabel was probably looking at a platoon role anyway.
The Pats got Deion Branch in the 2nd round. They got Asante Samuel in the 4th. They got Logan Mankins at the botton of the first. There is plenty of quality in the 34th pick area of the draft.
Yeah, I would have loved more, but there wasn't a big market for Cassel and the longer we held him, the greater the chance that we would've gotten stuck.
I'm fine with the move.

area of

It was a GREAT TRADE . . . . . .for the Chiefs.

I read Mike's analysis, but it doesn't add up to me. Why not wait a while before making this trade? That's exactly what they did with Bledsoe.

I only thing I can think of is that the Patriots have a tentative deal with a few free agents and they needed to free up the cap room immediately to sign these guys?

Not sure who those free agents would be since Bart Scott is now with the Jets.

Amazing! Here's a top ten list:
1. The Patriots pick Connor Barwin to replace Vrabel with pick #33.
2. The Patriots make a salary cap move.
3. The Patriots could not have almost $20 million in 2 qb's for 2009.
4. The Patriots felt comfortable in dealing with the Chiefs (former hometown discount.)
5. Mike Vrabel is a great guy, great teammate, but kept playing "mush the passer" last year.
6. The Patriots panicked in the FA period.
7. The Priots should have done much better than just a #33 pick.
8. There is something very fishy about this deal. it is NOT market competitive. Sage Rosenfels for a 4th rounder. Matt cCassel AND Vrabel for a 2nd??
9. The Patriots are not perfect. 1they have lost the mystic of "the patriot way".
10. Face facts - The Patriots will not continue to make the playoffs (probably another 5 years wwy....1. because they don't draft anyone other than a bunch of INJURED MIDGETS like Hobbs, Wheatley, and .) the last real CB they had was Ty Law (who played in 2 of 3 SB's championhsips.) 2. The offensive line is NOT good...it was for about 14 games in 2007. It's more porous than swiss cheese. 3. The D-Line is most overrated in football - Seymour's best days were 2001 - 2004. Warren is a contributor, not a dominator...I'll give credit to Wilfork - he's the only stud on D. 4. The Secondary is terrible. No Safties for either FS or SS. 4. No 3rd receiver. 5. No real running game (FRED TAYLOR WILL BE INJURED BEFORE SEPT.1st) finally, they have no coaches. BB simpy controls too much...

I don't believe anything you just wrote. This just sounds like the old patriots. Should we trade Tom Brady b/c he was a 7th round pick. It sounds like Mike Reiss is just afraid to say anything bad about the pats. Chicken!!!

They freed up millions, which is very valuable. They got a good price for a backup QB and aging LB. This trade won't be realized for several years, when we finally see what we received in return. Was a 2nd rounder too low? We have no idea today.

One thing we have learned is how valuable being under the cap was for the New England Patriots. It was worth a great deal to them.

Now, what are they going to do with the money?

Good, but not great deal. If Cassel sits the bench his value for next year plummets (memories are short in the NFL). He had a great year this year, but teams are rightfully afraid of a flash in the pan. Pats get what is close to a 1st round pick that gets signed at second round money. Don't forget KC is taking a big chance and paying big money unless and until contracts get restructured. Yes, they might end up with a great QB, but they might end up with someone average who gets beat-up by an inferior offensive line. BB must have some faith in Sanchez!

This deal suck the big one plain and simple and Mike you are kiss up. It does not matter that he was a 7th round pick. What mattered is the NFL QB rankings chart : 1 P. Rivers 2 C. Pennington 3 K. Warner 4 Drew Brees 5 P. Manning 6 A. Rodgers 7 M. Schaub 8 Tony Romo 9 J. Garcia 10 M. Cassel 11 Matt Ryan He had higher completion %, QB ranking, more yards, and the same number of touchdowns as last years SB winner Eli Manning. Notice the 11th ranked QB Matt Ryan who happened to be picked at nos 3 in the 1st rnd. We traded a top 10 QB for pick #34-Reiss get a clue-THIS deal plain out SUCKS!

What people seem to miss is that it isn't a matter of "Who is smarter? Pioli or Belichick?" It's a matter of "Who is smarter, Belichick or YOU?"
Pioli didn't wave a magic wand and force Belichick to make the move. Belichick and the personnel department made the move because he thought it was the best. Do you honestly think you know more than they do?

Seriously?

Last time I checked we were in the business of winning championships, not doing favors for our friends. Face it, we got taken advantage of and Belichick should be ashamed of himself for letting Vrabel be a part of this deal. I'm telling you right now that Bill will regret this when he watches Cassel turn into an MVP caliber QB. Vrabel is a startng outside LB. He should have been worth a 3rd or 4th alone. I can't believe Pioli couldn't have thrown in a low round pick as well. I would of rather gotten Gonzalez and a 4th for them. Maybe Pioli was the brains behind our dynasty all along.

Mike's analysis makes sense, but I am still wondering if the Pats at least tried to extract an additional pick for 2010 or 2011 based on Cassel's peformance this fall.

Just remember - If we didn't franchise him - He could have signed with the
friggin J-E-T-S. They controlled where he went and got the 34th pick. Vrabel might have been a salary cap casualty anyway.

Because Cassell was traded, is he no longer tagged, or is KC now responsible for the $14.6m? and if that is the case, is there not risk remaining for KC to actually sign him?

Everything you say is true... market conditions... couldn't afford to keep him... he coulda walked... etc. etc.... IT STILL SUCKS!! The Pats did the best they could (I guess).... but losing Vrabel too?? Good God man!.. Don't you think the Chiefs were desparate enough to just take Cassel for the pick? Losing Vrabel is like spit in the face... i don't know.... we wait... we watch... we'll see.

The Vrabel move was a simple salary dump. (btw, thanks Mr. Vrabel for being the consummate Patriot, you'll be missed). Cassel was worth about the same as Winslow. The Pats really should've gotten a second pick, maybe a 2010 5th rounder. Not a big deal to miss that in the grand scheme. The only way you get more than that is if a bidding war starts.
Also, I doubt the new cap space is to trade for Peppers, it's to sign Wilfork. Be glad for that. Having a top notch DT is crucial.

cassel AND vrabel for the 34th pick? ARE YOU FRIGGIN KIDDING ME?!

im ok with trading cassel for that... but WHY ADD VRABEL?!!

Will I agree with Mike's analysis about what the market would bear and that the Pats likely had to sweeten the pot with Vrabel to get it done, the bottom line is that the Patriots just traded two high performing known quantities for the unknown. It places extraordinary pressure on Belichick and company to make sure they get a high caliber player with the pick (#34) they received. It also should make it more palatable for them to resign Wilfork and perhaps Seymour. If either or both of those guys walk in 2010, given the cap room just freed, and that pick isn't a home run, this trade is a bust.

"In the end, the feeling here is that the Patriots turned a 2005 seventh-round draft choice -- a player many felt would be cut at the end of training camp (me included) -- into a valuable 2009 second-round pick."

Mike you moron, how high was Brady picked?

Everyone talks about all the second round busts. Ed Reed was a second rounder. So was Drew Brees. And if you add the 34th pick to the 23rd, the value is the 9th overall.

The trade was made because BB didn't want Cassel being sent to Denver. He us not happy about losing Paxton to the Bronco's. McDaniels could be Manginni Jr.

Trade blows, no matter how you look at it. Cassel straight up for the 2nd round pick, great deal. Throw in Vrabel, deal is a complete joke. I hope the NFL looks into this situaiton. Belichick greasing an ole freinds back, BS. We've been scammed. Yeah, we have freed up valuable cap space, but so what. Not a lot of free agents out there that we need, compared to what Vrabel already gave us, leadership, hard work, and guts!!!

I'm fine with this trade. Let's watch Cassel turn into AJ Feeley next year when he goes to a poor team without the studs around him like last year. I don't consider Cassel a "proven" Qb with one year under his belt - name 1 good team he beat last year. One?

He can manage games but struggles when he has to manufacture a win. Good luck to him a Vrabel - that draft pick will be used well.

This is almost a first round pick, but without first round money. When analyzing this pick, other names that have to be considered are Wilfork, Mankins, Gostkowski, and the rest of the free agent class next year. Now there's some cap room to do contracts with some of them.

Sorry Mike, appreciate the optimism, but I can't agree. The Pats rolled the dice w/the Franchise tag and crapped out. No conditiional pick next year. Not even a 7th this year? This deal will ultimately be judged by what the Pats do w/ #34 and the available cap space. Good luck Bill!

Just when I thought that Red Sox fans were the biggest idiot fanbase of all 4 New England sports teams, Pats fans are making a strong push for #1 idiot fanbase.... Vrabel is on the back nine and Cassel would had lost trade vaule by sitting behind Brady in '09. And it would be stupid to say that the Patriots should hold onto Cassel until the draft, because they wouldn't have any cap room to make ANY SIGNINGS!!!

Now let's look at how well the Pats have done in the 2nd round recently:
2004 Marquise Hill
2005 none
2006 Chad Jackson
2007 none
2008 Terrence Wheatley

Love these idiots who believe in a buyers market the team paying 14.5 million for a backup quarterback has all the leverage in these trade talks...

So this is how it works........KC takes out Tom Brady for the year in that first game to give Matt Cassel a chance to play knowing all along that Pioli was coming to KC and he was bringing Vrabel with him. The Chiefs deliberately tank last season to get the #3 pick and then Cassel comes over now that KC has covertly turned him into the best thing since slice bread by putting Brady on ice. All at once the Chiefs are big time. Genius really when you think about.

Reminds me of when Coach cut Lawyer Milloy...

In Bill I trust, and so should all of you.

Mike...I respect what you are trying to say, but I think you are looking at things through rose colored glasses. To begin with, they didn't even let any time elapse to see what other teams would do, especially those who need QB's. I think they should have let some time go by, and in doing so a better deal would have emerged with a team that 1) needs a starter and, 2) begins to feel a little desperate as each day goes by. Another thing....I'm not buying they "turned a 7th into a 2nd" bit. That's what teams do, draft the best they can and then groom their investments. Hey, Cassell's been the NE Patriots backup for a few years now! What they really did was turn another low round QB pick into a valuable NFL STARTER! This trade should stand on who the players are today, and the only question mark is can Cassel continue to do well. I think yes; so do football people smarter than I. Time will tell, but I feel in my gut that we got short-changed.

The answer to the first question is easily yes. We gave away Vrabel MIKE VRABEL for nothing.

MIKE VRABEL--definition-class act, football player. Thanks for the memories, good luck in the future!

I agree 100% w/Mike Reiss. Vrabel's skills have diminished and the number of teams interested in Cassell evidently was not as many as we were lead to believe. He is rightly or wrongly depicted as a product of the Pats system. #34 is reasonable and w/3 #2;s the Pats can wheel and deal as they usually due. Once again they have quietly gone abt their business filling holes and acquiring depth at RB, TE and possibly signing Bodden. The Pats have the best owner, coach and QB in the NFL.

If Pats simply needed cap space, just remove the franchise tag and let Cassel walk. The Pats would get a 3rd round pick next year (compensatory pick for losing a top free agent). So essentially, the Pats gave up Vrabel simply to move up one round in the draft. Terrible move.

"I would of rather gotten Gonzalez and a 4th for them. Maybe Pioli was the brains behind our dynasty all along."

I think we can be pretty sure of who wasn't.

-------------------------
G at 114 - Milloy and Johnson weren't drafted while Belichick was here.

I could have used Eugene Wilson instead. We traded Vrabel and Cassel for a player the quality of Eugene Wilson.

(C. Jackson and Wilson are the only early 2nd rounders I can recall us drafting in the Belichick era.)
-------------------------

Maybe know we should all wonder if Pioli was really the man behind the curtain. He just did to New England what he was been doing for us since he came here. Pioli will be missed more than Vrabel and Cassel

Mike,
are you say the talks of a 3 way deal b/w Detroit/Denver and Denver/Tampa were not serious options?

Proven, starting NFL quarterbacks are a 1st round pick...a second round pick is a stretch. Loosing Vrabel just added insult to injury. If the situation were reversed, we'd all be giddy saying how much better the Patriots are at making trades, and how they got a starting QA and a probowl LB for a 2nd round pick...we'd be saying that the Patriots got a steal. Unless there is more to come, the only conclusion is that the Patriots were the losers in this trade.
PS. One could argue that if Vrabel was traded for an undisclosed pick (the 2nd), then the Patriots got NOTHING for Cassel.

Inventive & brilliant. Vrabel is a champion and moves on with the dignity he played with to the Patriots Mid-West. Poli returns the 34th pick for a former 7th round pick who rose to starting status. Patriots win and Chiefs win.
Who would have ever thought a Belichick defense would be a liability?
That has been the case the last three years.
Could have been two more rings without the defensive shortcomings.
Vrabel left it all on the field. A true champion.

I agree with Dave down South...the last team to help out is KC...is Bill trying to help out his pal Pioli? I think the trade stinks (i could use a stronger word)...should we also give the Bruschi? and maybe the cheer leaders too??
im not pleased....
Joe in NC

let's see what the 18,5 millions buys before we do a full evaluation--resigning wilfork, mankins and adding a db will make it a very good deal--

maybe they can get another chad jackson!! that's who they picked with their last high second round pick. however, if they had gotten somewhere into the bottom of the first round, then their record is much better. there's gotta be more....

This deal stinks of favoritism, from Belichick to Pioli.

There is no Logic in throwing Vrabel into a deal for a 2nd round pick. Cassell not worth that, by his lonesome? Bull. Collins just signed for $15m over two. Cassell is without any question worth the pick.

And I do not agree with this statement at all: "whose contract expires after 2009 and probably wouldn't have been back in 2010". Vrabel has been, arguably, the better player but Bruschi played into his 35th year, why couldn't Vrabel? and that after a very serious stroke.

What is going on here. Is Belichick heading to KC next?

Cassel's departure was probably a foregone conclusion due to the cap and a second round pick for him seems like an even trade, but giving up Vrabel as part of the deal just doesn't sit well. For all he brings to the table, he alone was worth a draft pick (probably not a second rounder) so it seems we basically got nothing in return. To Vrabel, thanks for playing your heart out for this team...you will be missed.

Why do none of m comments show up?

TheBigOldDog - I heard Adam Schefter confirm on the NFLN that Detroit and Tampa Bay contacted the Patriots about Cassel too (supposedly in an effort to spin him to Denver for Jay Cutler). That just tells me their offer wasn't as good as KC's. DET and TB obviously weren't willing to give up 1st round picks so if it came down to 2nd rounders then it was between DET (#33), KC (#34) and TB (#50). I don't blame Belichick for choosing KC's pick over Detroit's. I would've taken the pick ONE spot lower to send Cassel to Pioli and KC rather than the train-wreck of an organization that is Detroit. I'm sure Cassel would've chosen KC over Detroit if he had the option. You can't honestly believe Detroit offered the 20th pick in the draft and Belichick said, "no, I'd rather trade with my friend."

As for Vrabel - with all due respect to him and everything he's done, a soon-to-be 34-year old OLB coming off a down season with one year left on his deal isn't going to bring much compensation, even if he does have an immaculate work-ethic and character. Philly just lost their defensive leader of 13 years (Brian Dawkins) for nothing.

Dirty Water - KC will undoubtedly sign Cassel to a long-term deal if they haven't already in order to significantly lower that cap hit.

Did any consider they tried to accumuate picks to trade them for a really good player? - Julius Peppers perhaps. They have three 2nd round picks and two 3rd round picks. Maybe a 2 & 3 gets them Peppers. Maybe they plan on taking a run at a LB who isn't 33 and on the downside of his career. Jesus, Have some faith in BB. He's always had a plan and he does this time as well. We just have to wait and see.

What a joke? We traded the heart of our defense to move up 30 spots. This is Heathcliff Slocumb for Tek and Lowe. We got screwed!

This may have been discussed already, but we got Moss for a fourth round pick. A lot of people here think Vrabel is worth more than this? Don't think so.

Why do I get the feeling that the Patriots could sign my grandmother to play cornerback and Mike Reiss would laud it as a brilliant, visionary move?

Mike, you're the best beat writer of any sport in this town and I admire your work ethic and reporting ability, but your failure to objectively criticize the team is disappointing at times.

Hey Mike,
Thanks for the analysis. I never thought that we'd get multiple picks for Cassel in the first place so that doesn't shock me. Losing Vrabel is hard to take, but we need to get younger and faster on defense. This opens up money to help keep alot of our other veterans, gives us three second round picks in a linebacker-rich draft and should lay to rest any fan concern over Tom Brady's knee.

Comment 16: "Wow.... Reiss I have to disagree? This trade is far from solid, it SUCKS. There was no way Kansas City could have gotten someone as good as Cassell with the 34th overall pick."

COUGH.....COUGH....Brady....pick 199, moral here not every great player is drafted in round 1.

All those new personnel folks they brought in, and this is what they came up with? Really? Ugh.

I hope Bill knows something we don't know. Maybe he's setting up shop for when he heads to KC himself in the future.

What kind of a future deal between Pioli and Bellichick was this? And Nick Caserio, Reese, etc. all agreed to this? Boy, this is the LAST straw cause I am giving up my Pats season tix cuz this deal has so much of a stench it is literally pathetic....

if it was a high 2nd for cassel alone i would have been fine with it , when you factor in vrabel it ends up being a 3rd or 4th ....not good value !!!!!

Had hoped for more for the Pats, but who knows what Cassel's worth more than Belichek & Pioli? Basically got a late first round pick at 2d round price, & likely a good working relationship with someone higher in the draft, if the Pats need to move up to get someone later. A good deal for all :)

I hope there is a bigger plan in mind free up space for secondary help. I think Vrabel is too valuable to be a throw in. Much like mike O'connell with Joe thornton I don't think they did much shopping. Or maybe Pioli has been the brains of this outfit after all. So far another retread back a so so tight end to replace Cassels, Vrabel, gaffney and Paxton. The new front office staff is not winning my confidence.

Why not let Vrabel play out his contract and trade Cassel for 3rd rounder by himself??? Can this D-fence really afford to loose Vrabel, Colvn, Seau, Harrison etc all in the same off season? Not to mention that Teddy B has lost more than one step...

Mike: is it foolish for me to speculate that Mike Vrabel being added to the deal was a condition that the PATS required to get this thing done? In other words "we want your second for Matt but you have to take one of these veterns off our roster" - my thought being clearing as much money as possible to sign big Vince and bring in a corner?
Keep up the good work

Reiss, I didn't realize that you were such a schill for the Patriots. Where's the outrage? John Tomase has more credibility than you.

The Patriots are reloading. Don't get hung up on the "only getting a 2nd rd pick for a franchise QB". Yes, he got the franchise tag, but Brady, not Cassel, is this team's franchise QB. We turn a 7th rd draft pick into an early 2nd rd pick this year, we are no longer tying up $29.2 million in cap space on QB's, we pick up Taylor and Baker to improve two areas, and there's still the rumor of the Pats going after Peppers, which would be a genius move. It hurts to lose Vrabel, but getting Peppers would be worth it.

I think Mike's right about this. I've been listening to ESPN all day, and they all seem to think the Pats didn't get near enough for Cassell. I agree with Mike--a high second round pick is a heck of a lot better than $29.5 million against the cap for just ONE position on the field. We all gotta face the fact too that--as much as we all love Mike Vrabel as the quintessential Pats' type of player--he's maybe 2-3 years past his peak. As much as it would be great to pay a guy what he's worth to a team for leadership, locker room presence, and a host of other tangibles, the cap is a brutal ceiling.
I'M wondering if BB and Pioli didn't work all of this out ahead of Scott's move. No one seemed to make it difficult for Scott P. to leave Foxboro. Did BB get a verbal promise of the second round Chief's pick in return for taking out that $14.5 million franchise tag cap hit and taking care of Mike Vrabel in a way the Pats probably wouldn't be able to ? Who else would have been trying to get Cassell for the franchise tag burden?

I have to admit; my first instinct was "that's all we get". But while not completely pysched about it ... we must remember that his guy sat on the bench for almost 4 years and still would have been on the bench - likely for his career - if Brady does not get hurt. Forget Vrabel, we need to get young. No doubt there will a lot more moves. When we are back in the Super Bowl next all this will be forgotten. Seriously, who scares you next year. We went 11-5 with half them team on IR. We are about to load up for the next five years. Don't do a Seattle and get all mushy over Junior coming back at age 39. The Pats are getting younger and faster on the D-line.

people people....Mike V was about done ....he still gets a chance to play... wish cassell...either lose him for nothing (f/a) or take what you can get,,,,,34 pick is good......we all want more......look at the beggers going to to govt for free stuff....housing food.healthcare,,,,,,,GOOF DEAL BB

Maek at # 172. You have to clue what was going on with Det and TB. You dont know what they were willing to offer us. BB and Pioli have a certified Bromance going on.

You people who honestly believe that Bill Belichick, perhaps the most cold-blooded man in pro football, would hamstring his current team just to do Scott Pioli a favor are too stupid to breathe.

This trade was about two things-- acquiring value picks to rebuild an aging defense, and clearing cap space to sign Vince Wilfork, Logan Mankins, et al (not to mention picking up some solid free agents this year).

Great analysis Mike.... oh yeah, and Belichick called. He'll need you to shovel his front walk if it snows tomorrow.

I think the question most pats fans initially asked upon hearing this was "What the @#$%!'. However, after thinking about it, the trade may not be that bad. If the Pats had not franchised Cassel, they would have lost him and recieved only a 2010 end-of-the-third-round compensatory draft pick. So if we could undo all this would we? In other words would we now trade the 34th pick in this years draft for Vrabel and a late 3rd rounder next year. This would include a cap hit of $4.5 M. I don't think so

It was either this or two starting QBs and counting on Vrabel for the season. We got a 2nd rounder, about $15M to play with, and thus another FA or three and Vrabel's replacement. Good deal If you're not drinking the KoolAid yet, you're just not paying attention.

HORRIBLE DEAL. Yes I would rather keep Vrabel and get a 3rd rounder for CASSELL (OR...we could sign him to a realistic contract and then trade him). This deal is an absolute insult to Pats Fans and Mr. Reiss, your logic defies logic.

I don't understand the quality/value realtionship of what just transpired here. I really don't. You have a top ten rated NFL QB with great character, little to no ego or excess baggage and you have a very solid /versatile LB with loads of leadership TEAM qualities and you just traded the two of them to Kansas City for a SECOND PICK in the SECOND ROUND of the upcoming draft.

*And Mikey stop trying to make it sound better with that thirty-sixth overall tripe.
Value is value and I find it very difficult to believe that we rec'd anywhere near a true value compensation here.
OR
As Peggy Lee used to sing....'Is That All there Is?'

I know I sound like Peggy Lee here, but.... Is That All There Is?

Disaster. Collusion? Sure looks that way. Brady damn well better be the Tom Terrific of old, there's gonna be hell to pay for letting Cassel go for a pittance.

Wow! You really disapoint me Reiss. Either your head is too far up the organizations butt for you to think clear, or you aren't as insightful and football savy as I once thought you were. Stop looking for the silver lining and call it what it is - a sucky deal in which Pioli showed us why he was so respected around the league. Some of these lame arguments to justify this ridiculous deal make me want to vomit. Grow up Pom-Pom Mikey Reiss and do some big boy analysis. At least be man enough in a year or two when this deal plays out to be the joke it is to admit it. I won't be holding my breath for the "I guess i was wrong story" though. P.S.- Bob Kraft called - Kool-Aid is on the top shelf. He has your monogramed cup on the counter waiting for you. Enjoy.

I'm not disappointed that we didn't get a first round pick. I'm fine with the 34th being the highlight of the deal. What bothers me is that there wasn't any additional picks. A conditional pick next year, a fifth or something this year. I find it hard to believe Kellen Winslow netted a similar package than Cassel/Vrabel combined. Yes, the Patriots had a higher second pick, but WInslow brought in a mid-second and a fifth. Lito Sheppard is brining in a fifth and possibly a conditional pick next year (possibly a second). I understand wanting to clear the cap space as early in free agency as possible, but I figure you could wait another day or two to see what else comes. When teams were hearing the Chiefs were close, they started talking. The Pats should've been able to get a better deal.

Not a good deal for the Pats. You've giving up essentially two starters for one draft choice who may or may not ever start a game. It's a very long shot that the Pats will received equal compensation for what they gave up. I could see them giving up Cassel, but throwing Vrabel into the mix was a bonehead move. There's got to be more going on here than meets the eye.

Scott, for every Tom Brady taken in the late rounds there are hundreds who never make it. That's why they don't get drafted until the 6th round. The real moral of the story is that there is a legitimate reason they don't go until the second day.

A good deal is when both sides are equally unhappy.

I don't think this is the case. KC has to be estatic.

Hey Yossarian at # 192
Cassel was oh in the top 10 in QB according to the NFL. Matt Ryan was ranked number 11. Ryan was picked at number 3 in the first round and was unproven. Cassel ranked at number 10 and proven now. YES THIS IS A STUPID MOVE BY BB. Oh, here is the history of the last few years #34 pick Boss Baily, Chris Snee, Brodney Pool ,D’Qwell Jackson, Paul Posluzny, Devin Thomas. Chris Snee the only real stand out there. Nice work Bill

Vrabel leaving hurts. Cassel? Well, Chiefs fans probably remember Elvis Grbac- another super-sub on a Super Bowl powerhouse that wasn't bad but wasn't so super either.

NFL network is reporting that the lions and bucs were trying to put togeather a better offer then the chiefs but the pats didn't let them counter anything. what is that all about? It doesn't make any sense. they are suppused to get the best for the team. This was a back door trade for reasons that we will never know!

Are you people lost? Do you crybabies not at all understand the positive salary cap implications? Have you considered that Bill and Bob know Vrabel is no longer able to perform at the level of a... say... Julius Peppers? Did you all so geekishly buy into the Matt Cassel franchise hype, when Bob ran that game just to see if some geek owner would take the bait? Are you one of them? Before the faux Franchise tagging you would have been happy to get ANYTHING in return for freebie Matt. And if you didn't nearly vommit when you heard he was tagged (only to quickly realize it was a rouse) then you clearly have NO clue how the salary cap affects this game, and think Bill and Bob are as lost as you are. And if you don't realize that Pioli owes us BIG TIME... to the tune of "no touch" of our draft targets and free agent targets... as well as other future sweeteners for the buddy deal, then you really are clueless. Bottom line? Vrabes was a cap heavy down-sider, get over him. He is. Brady will come back and dominate. Stop hating on him. We'll get Peppers or some other stud who is on the upside of his career. And we'll still have more low round draft picks than we need to build a great team... esp. now that we have another pass catching veteran RB. Wake up New England... the folks who really know this game got this one right!

Talking about too stupid to breathe..

1) Vrabel's base in 2008 was only $1.8m AND the Patriots will still to take a million dollar cap hit while he's in KC (prorated bonus). Vrabel leaving clears NO cap space. Indeed, it may cost more than $1.8m to replace him.

2) The whole point some here are getting at is Cassell is worth a 2nd all by himself, and if the market were truly transparent, Det, TB, or others would have offered at least that much.

3) It's debatable if owning a solid backup to Brady is not worth a franchising Wilfork or Mankins, at least in 2009.

The only rational in tossing Vrabel into the deal is to help Pioli. Consider it a thank you from Belichick to Pioli.

Vrabel's going into a contract year and had made clear he wasn't going the home town discount route. He had repeatedly referred to Patriots Place as an additional source of "NFL" revenue that the Krafts should be obligated to share. I think management was put off by these comments, especially from a player on the decline.

The Pats got a 2nd round pick for Cassell, Vrabel was a salary dump.

Mike,
Please stop drinking the BELI-aid. This deal is not good. I would vouch that Cassel is beeter than Schaub, and he was traded for a first and a second. And that is not even accounting for Vrabelm who is a huge locker room loss as well as defensive field general. We got hosed.

Mike, I appreciate your insights, my son and I were bummed to hear about Vrabel because you want those kind of guys to retire here but this game has changed dramatically over the years. We are very happy for Cassel and hope he and the Chiefs have many good years to come (as long as the Pats win the matchups of course).

I'm a Chiefs fan from Kansas City and I was reading the local comment in the Kansas City papers to see the reaction to this trade, but I also wanted to see the local reaction from Pat's fan, so I thought I'd stop by and see what people in New England thought about the trade. From an outsiders perspective, here are some concerns that people in Kansas City have towards Cassel and the trade in general.

- Cassel has only had one year of success in the NFL, so calling him a "proven NFL starter" is a bit premature.
- Cassel's successful year meant that he barely cracked 20 td's for the year, so even with his success, it wasn't like he lit the NFL on fire.
- Cassel was throwing to Randy Moss and Wes Welker.
- Cassel is not under contract beyond this year, and he has already agreed to accept a huge amount of money under the franchise offer.
- Vrabel is a 33 year old linebacker who only has one year remaining on his contract.

So, most people in Kansas City aren't really celebrating just yet. I think it remains to be seen who gets the best of this deal. I just thought you might want to hear an outsiders perspective of this trade, coming from someone who is not a fan of Cassel, Vrabel, or the Patriots.

when the trade for Vrabel was release i said you have to be kidding me- but after thinking about Mike not coming back in 2010, and cap space being freed up i was okay with this deal. The Pats fans need to look at what would of been if we could not trade him or let him walk with a 3nd rounder next year. This draft is deep and if we get one of the USC LB's We need to hope that with this money we address the def line, off guard because we lose those guys then this deal makes no sense- so let's be patience and wait for the draft -5 picks in the top 89 picks!!

Consider this: The Patriots received a first round #24 pick in the 2007 NFL Draft for Deion Branch and only got a second rounder for Cassel. Now tell me again how this was a good or even a fair trade?

bribe to pioli's mouth shut about spygate!!!!

All you guys agreeing with the trade to free up salary cap are right. What they got in return is crap. At a minimum they should have gotten a player and a 2nd or two high choices. Just bad deal making period salary cap freeing as it may be.

Unless something is still shrouded in secrecy surrounding this deal (possible considering BB) this deal was bad. If they get some good draft picks or trade for Ray Lewis and sign all the rest o the FA's they want that does not make this deal good

Not a great deal...but Cassell had to be dealt now to get cap space. Vrabel WAS grrat,but not last year. Let's see what other moves BB makes.RELAX .

All you guys agreeing with the trade to free up salary cap are right. What they got in return is crap. At a minimum they should have gotten a player and a 2nd or two high choices. Just bad deal making period salary cap freeing as it may be.

Unless something is still shrouded in secrecy surrounding this deal (possible considering BB) this deal was bad. If they get some good draft picks or trade for Ray Lewis and sign all the rest o the FA's they want that does not make this deal good

I stil SAY TAKE a look at the past 4 year drafts. They haven't been that great.

Cassell for a #2 does make sense, either that you trade Brady which they didn't.

They need to get younger, faster, and sign Wilfork. Seymour may be a goner in 2 years.

I agree with #'s 88 and 122. There must be a reason why BB made the trade early. They usually wait for bargains to fall into their lap, except when they picked up A. Thomas early. Me thinks a quick move is coming. Who? --don't know. I was hoping for a 2nd and a 4th for Matt. The only thing no one else mentioned is that their is a lot of good will being traded here. I for one am glad to see them go to KC where they are in good hands. Better than Detroit. Down the line other free agents will be glad to know that there is professionalism and good will in NE. It fits in with our stars playing for a little less for a chance to get in with a good organization and a fair shake on the way out. Easier to get FA's that way.

Cassel and Vrabel for a second round pick sucks. I am sorry but a two for one deal is just not good. They gave Vrabel away for nothing. I never thought I say this but BB blew it. Unless they peddle that pick into Peppers they got screwed. That second pick better be able to throw 15 TD passes, catch 2 -3 TD passes, get 6 sacks and make 70 tackles.

Must mean that Brady is healing well.

I haven't read all of the comments here and this may have been brought up, but has anyone considered the possibility that the Patriots may have wanted Vrabel (who is a known union guy and locker room lawyer) off of the team? Especially after his comments regarding Patriot Place and how Kraft was making money off of the Patriots name. Kraft, that ROTTEN CAPITALIST!!!! I think I'd want him off my team too given these comments AND the fact that his production has been on a steady decline since 2007.

Big Tim you are not going to get any of those USC LB as they will be gone you moron ... they will be gone before #15 pick ... & you know football?

Cassel had a good year with randy Moss and Wes Welker, he took the best offense ever to the best non playoff record ever. Don't get me wrong he was fun to see grow, but if he were on the Lions you think he'd ever be worth a draft pick. The Pats have the same problem they had last year at this time, old linebackers. They needed the cap space and other teams knew it. I love Vrabel but where was he the second half of the year? PS given the way Brady, and Cassel turned from nobody to superstar, don't ypou think the Pats can get Guiterrez, and O'connoll to do the same. There is a reason that O'Connoll was drafted in the 3rd round. Not a bad deal, not a great deal, but tehy got some worth for their work as well as 20 mill in cap space

Hey whr, before you flame Big Tim.....Couldn't they trade up to get one of those USC LB's? They have plenty of picks, no?

Thanks New England!!! We'll keep taking em! Wow, you guys got the shaft.

The "lack" of compensation makes sense if you factor in that in addition to 5 picks in the first 89, they just might get another 3rd (compensatory) for A. Samuel. If 1 of those was instead a high first rounder, then they might have had problems signing Wilfork, Mankins, Seymour in the coming couple of years, without cutting for salary cap reasons someone who they'd preferred not to lose. Also, that 2010 might be an uncapped year might be figuring in their thinking. I don't mind getting #34 as it's a "classic" value pick which the Pats covet. I just wish their had been a 4th involved.as well.

You have gotta be kidding me! This is ridiculous. Is Bill B or Robert Kraft going to buy the KC Chiefs? Otherwise the loss of Vrable AND Cassell for A #2 makes no sense. Shoud have gotten Tony Gonzales - Scott Pioli has got to be laughing big time!

I agree with #'s 88 and 122. There must be a reason why BB made the trade early. They usually wait for bargains to fall into their lap, except when they picked up A. Thomas early. Me thinks a quick move is coming. Who? --don't know. I was hoping for a 2nd and a 4th for Matt. The only thing no one else mentioned is that their is a lot of good will being traded here. I for one am glad to see them go to KC where they are in good hands. Better than Detroit. Down the line other free agents will be glad to know that there is professionalism and good will in NE. It fits in with our stars playing for a little less for a chance to get in with a good organization and a fair shake on the way out. Easier to get FA's that way.

People seem to be missing the most important piece of this whole thing. All signs point to Brady being ready to roll. Resigning Wilfork alone is more important for the next few years than Vrabel or Cassel and this should help them do that. Do I wish they could have got more.?Yes. Do I think they got better offers and suddenly became clueless and did not take them? Absolutely not. Use commons sense. People don't realize they are likely targeting certain players or have things in the works so they need the money now. You can't sit around and wait...the a) your stuck with Cassel and can't make any moves b) All the free agents that can help get signed elsewere.Peoople are overreacting.

People seem to be missing the most important piece of this whole thing. All signs point to Brady being ready to roll. Resigning Wilfork alone is more important for the next few years than Vrabel or Cassel and this should help them do that. Do I wish they could have got more.?Yes. Do I think they got better offers and suddenly became clueless and did not take them? Absolutely not. Use commons sense. People don't realize they are likely targeting certain players or have things in the works so they need the money now. You can't sit around and wait...the a) your stuck with Cassel and can't make any moves b) All the free agents that can help get signed elsewere.Peoople are overreacting.

I would think the Pats would have recieved a little more in the way of compenstation, but we did slash about $18 million of the payroll for 2009. Now there is money availbale for Mankins, and Wilfork as well as an impact free agent or two. We will also have 4 picks in the first two rounds. All in all, this looks like it will work out. I will miss Vrabel however!

Two problems with this deal.

1) Should have gotten more for Cassel.
2) You never trade a Vrabel. You stick with a player like that due to loyalty.

#2 is a flaw in Belichick's personality. Great coach, but still has flaws, and this is one.

I see this as a decent trade they get what they can for cassell along with vrabel and they get a 2nd rounder and free up cap space to sign other players or free agents who knows maybe they trade a couple 2nd rounders for a first, the possibiles are endless.

Sorry Mike - you sound like the proverbial House Organ here. Looks like Pioli really was the off-the-field brains behind this outfit after all. Such a deal would never have occurred on his watch.

Between knocking Brady out for the year, taking Pioli, and schmoozing Cassel and Vrabel for 2nd rounder, the Chiefs have pretty much owned New England in the last twelve months.

I hope Pioli kissed 'em first.

Type your comment here...

The trade sucks. There is no way to justify it. The patriots just gave up two big time players for a second round choice. The NFL is all about franchise quarterbacks. If you don't have one, you don't win. And the patriots just handed one to a team within their conference. And Mike you suck too - you won't criticize it because you would have to face these dumb asses in the front office who just made this deal.

In as much as Vrabel was approaching the end of his effectiveness, Tedy Bruschi has been non-existent for the past two years. The guy has been an inspiration and one of my favorite Patriots, but his time is up. If everyone's all jazzed up about increasing cap space, let's throw Tedy's salary into the fray as well. Not a time to be sentimental.

This is not a good trade. GIving up Cassel was OK but why Vrabel?? Seems like you could have gotten the same trade for just Cassel. If not, wait it out. It was much too soon to make this deal. Beside Vrabel is one of those guys you need to keep around for his career - he was loyal and always played all out.

Type your comment here...Loosing Vrabel is a mistake-probobly the most underated Patriot of all time. They should have gotten at least a low first round pick for just Cassel. After all he was a top ten quaterback in just his first year.

Time for big changes and no sentimentality, just like the Sox. Bruschi next? Maroney?
Defense has betrayed ths team since the loss to the Colts in the AFC championship a couple of years ago, get younger, faster!

Good analysis. It's unfortunate that this is the best they could get. To paraphrase Mike Felger from yesterday, perhaps the lousy teams that should of been pursuing Cassell just aren't. This is explained by the fact that these teams (like Detroit, Minnesota, etc) are lousy for a reason. Some of the players signed, such as Culpepper & Sage Rosenthal (instead of pursuing Cassell) are pathetic. Good luck to those teams.
KC is on the rebound. Good for them.

WTFO? I hope there is more to this than the 2nd rounder. Call it what you want but Cassel and Vrabel were STARTERS last year for this team... so one second-round pick (albeit earlY)has the value of two starters? Not sure I am following the logic . For a team that brought back Junior and Rosie for leadership and ability last year, I just don't get letting Vrabel go.

The team will have 6 picks in the first three rounds, in an extremely deep draft ,after they are awarded a comp for losing Samuel. If they can draft a safety, TE, and a CB that can contribute, no team will stop us.
Vrabel was stellar from 01" to 06' but is definitely on the downside and I believe Cassel will be a serviceable QB for KC but was more a product of Coach B's system than an MVP.
Overall, a great deal giving a 7th rounder for the 33rd pick in the draft.

Good points, thegiff. Vrabel, not getting any younger, was near invisible over the last half of the season. And Cassell ? He was outstanding, for sure, and made enormous strides from the first few weeks through the end of the season....but, come on, putting him in the top 5 or even top 10 QB's in the league is ridiculous (top 5) and a stretch (top 10). And the Pats bargaining position (even if there were 3-4 interested teams) was not good; there was NO WAY on Earth that the Pats could keep a $15M franchised QB on a team with Tom Brady. Every football person with 1/2 brain knew they HAD to trade Cassell...not a position from which a team could demand (without chuckling) a #1 and #3 or even a mid-or-better #1.

Let’s see what Cassel and Vrabel do next year before we jump off any bridges here. A lot of you talk out of both sides of your mouth too. Pioli is a genius and Belichick is an idiot because we haven't gotten anybody good in the second round recently? Well, wasn't Pioli involved in that too? The picks are only a CHANCE at a good player. Cassel could have had his best year last year too. The offense around him was BETTER this year than it was for Brady in 2007 and he only threw 21 TDs. Getting Vrabel off the books this year instead of next is GREAT, and it did NOT have the same effect as cutting him either. The money is free rather than accelerated into this year. What difference is he making with his 4 sacks? He is going to do the same thing Willie McGinnist did and go to another team for a few years, play nowhere as well as he did for us, and retire. If we can sign Peppers, somehow get into position for Rey Mauluaga, and shore up the secondary, we will be unstoppable next year. Stop being nostalgic and be excited for free agency (now that we have room under the cap) and the draft (now that we have 3 second rounder’s).

i think the patriots really blew it.although the 36th pick is a high pick.the patriots clearly should have gotten more out of this.a no.#1,plus maybe a 3rd thrown in .why throw in mike vrabel,who had clearly slipped and was no longer worth that kind of money?

yeah,belichik has something up his sleeve.not getting enough value.you know kaft had something to do w/ this,not wanting to pay a player 1st rd. money.sad to see matt cassell go.would have been great to keep both qb's,but probably not very realistic in today's nfl.

what will belichik do?can't you guess he's gonna trade this pick(2nd rounder) on next year(maybe a 1st rounder) (no, i disagree/bad move).don't forfeit the present for the future .as the patriots have proven hasn't paid off.the patriots have choked the last three yr's in playoffs.they'll be lucky w/ these moves and the brutal schedule to make the playoffs!

one good thing though.you have floyd reese,and nick caserio running this draft.not the mediocrity that pioli has given us the past four years.sign some top free agents.sign our best players.you already lost out on keith brooking.would have been great.like another new tedi bruschi.

I don't fault the Pats. I do fault all the other teams that need QBs. There is a general impression out there that Matt preformed well filling in for Brady. IT WAS A LOT MORE THAN THAT. Witness the gutsy comebacks against the Jets and Seahawks, or the Oakland game blowout just after his dad passed. This guy has it. Why the NFL market would not yield more for Matt is beyond me.

I'm a little disappointed but, I'd rather have an early second round pick than a late first. There's always great value to be had early in the second round. Cassel had one year starting in the NFL. He's unproven, but Vrabel included though he's older doesn't seem smart for the Pats. The Pats are too injury prone to be giving up starting talent. Just my thoughts

Explain HOW there wasn't a market for Matt Cassel in the NFL? You're telling me Sage Rogenfels is a better alternative to a contender like the Vikings? Tampa Bay is happy with no QB? Detroit wouldn't want him more? The Bears, the king of terrible QB's, thinks Kyle f'n Orton is the solution? Washington throws $100 million at Haynesworth, yet they think Jason Campbell is a championship QB? What a joke this league is. If there isn't a market for a 26 year old proven QB, then there isn't a market for anyone.

Classless, you have class. I live down here near DC and the Skins blow $100 mil on low-character Haynesworth. He may be a beast on the field but this is not a transformational move. Picking up Matt and demoting Campbell might have been such a move. They could have used the money they would have saved to rehab the O-line.

keith (#191) - You're right, I have no idea what what said between the Patriots and DET and TB but neither do you or anyone else commenting on here for that matter. All we can do is draw a conclusion from the fact that DET, TB, and KC all contacted the Patriots to discuss a trade for Matt Cassel, and a deal was made with KC. The difference between me and you is that I actually used logic and common sense to draw my conclusion while you just resorted to a silly, soap opera theory...

Quote from the Denver Post:
"The deal had Tampa Bay trying to acquire Cutler in exchange for a first-round draft pick. In turn, the Broncos would have traded the first-round draft pick to New England in exchange for quarterback Cassel."

Still think we took the best deal?
NOT.

Mike - Can you please confirm or deny Chris Mortensen's report that the Pats were offered a 1 and a 3 for Cassel. If correct, how could the Patriots possibly explain why they would not take that offer over the one they accepted from KC?

Mike,
Firstly, I would like to apologize for my little tirate last night regarding the cassal trade. Sometimes the morning after brings regrets. You are very good at what you do. I respect your views. I must for I read them daily.

I still don't agree with the decision. There was panic, they needed to be more patient. Furthermore, Kansas City may be this year's Miami. Why give a team in your conference a missing piece? Trade him fo a 2nd to the NFC.

Some of you people need to face the truth. At the end of last year's PRE SEASON, I would make a calculated guess that 99% of Pats fans were in shock that Cassel wasn't cut. He looked like a high school kid out there on a big man's field for the three season he was collecting a pay chack. And, in fact, that is what he really is.

Last season, with thanks for his performance, was an anomily. He had a season that he will never, IMO, even come close to duplicating. He had a cast around him, including the coaching staff, and a fairly simple schedule, to accomplish what he did, even thoughhe has, and still has, many weaknesses, particularly in mid to deep passing plays and he still appears incapable of reading the field. I expect him to do absolutely NOTHING with the Chiefs, and the deal the Pats made for him was a good one, seeing as, apparently not one other team though much of Cassel either because it appears, none of them were interested in him, possibly for the same reasons that I just mentioned. At least he will have made some decent money, but that's as far as his NFL career will go. He just does not have it and the Pats did a good thing.,

ONLY time will tell how GOOD or BAD a Deal this really was!
I GOT ALL MY MONEY of BILL, lets not try to out think him ....BOYS!

We now have a bigger hole at LB than we do at CB. Get used to teams running on us.

With news that BB turned down the 12th pick to Denver I like this trade even better. He just blew up the Bronco's locker room and made McDaniels job tougher. He didn't want to improve two teams he is playing this year. Now with Cassel is KC SD, Den and KC are going to beat up on each other. Tampa has no qb. He is doing what is best for his team. He is the master

Lets be serious. Can any of you look me in the eye and tell me Cassel was not worth the 3rd overall pick?? Throw in a third rounder for Vrabel, with a conditional pick next year contigent upon Cassels/Chiefs success and the we're approaching a fair deal. I suspect this deal was struck before Pioli accepted the job with KC. If not, why the hurry??! There were other offers that appear better than this one (see Denver Post). We got screwed. We blew the chance to set up our team and instead set up KC. We give them a franchise QB, and a starting olb and team captain for the 34th pick?! AND LET THEM KEEP THEIR 3RD OVERALL PICK. Hey Scott! Can we get you anything else??? Want fries with that? What a ripoff. For those of you who think we can duplicate the value of Jerod Mayo or Mike Vrabel with the 34th pick, I've got a brand new bridge here in Jacksonville I'll sell you real cheap.
I hope Pioli appreciates his juicy severance package. This was a back-door buddy deal all the way, or sheer stupidity. If it wasn't a buddy deal, then we just found out who the REAL brains behind the Patriots success was, and now he's gone. They aren't telling us everything. Don't be surprised if Belichick ends up in KC in couple of years. I'm disgusted. We better win and win big the next couple of years.