Jason Taylor fallout

If the Bills do end up picking up Pisa....I won't even try to butcher his last name....formerly of the Rams, do you see the Pats maybe trading for one of their guys? I don't think Posluzny (or however it's spelt...not my fault they all have difficult to spell last names) would be available, but what about Keith Ellison? Do you think the Pats and Bills could do business, a la Bledsoe, or do you think the in-division trading (especially to Belichick) might be done after the Welker deal (considering how well that worked out for us)? Would the Pats be interested?

This makes me hate Jason Taylor even more. What a dope! After last year's surprising 11-5 and this year's project tough schedule - Miami will struggle to be .500. Have fun with the Jason.

Shawn Crable's spaghetti legs will snap like a toothpick. Banta Cain and Redd have zero pass rush ability and Pierre Woods is a semi servicable back up at best. As of now, their best option may be to re-sign the geriatric McGinest.

Can any Pat's fans explain to me why they believe Jason Taylor would have been an effective, productive player in January in Foxboro? He is where he belongs, in a warm weather city whose team is at best a first round playoff loser.

Good we can put this topic to rest and continue not liking him...............trade Watson and pick for Peppers and get it over with .............

Rob in Central MA,

Ellison is a former safety that they are using at LB and Pisa would replace him in the Bills 4-3, Ellison is too small for a 4-3 defense never mind the 3-4.

I am hoping Woods and Crable somehow do great, because (barring a trade or a preseason cut) there aren't any great options out there.

Taylor back to the 2008 AFC East Champs !

Not going to lie I'm disappointed the patriots didn't get taylor. But I am not worried because there has to be a reason why the pat's did not draft an outside linebacker in the draft. They either think the guy's they have in-house will get it done or a big move is coming soon.

Yeah, lots of people what Watson. I see that deal getting done real soon ;). Watson sucks

Woods, Banta-cain, Crable and Senior Seau in a rotating outside linebacker platoon!

Where's the money gonna come from Christian? They'd have to trade a bigger contract like Seymour and/or Jarvis and multiple others to make it all come to fruition.

What does it mean?

The Dolphins will still stink. Taylor is washed up anyway. Who wanted in him the first place? Get Peppers!

Why do people panic about not having big expensive names and still act like patriot fans?

it's super bowl title or bust this year, and everyone knows it - you have to believe belichick has a plan for vrabel's spot.... bruschi's too for that matter

are crable and guyton ready?

All of you who think Peppers is coming...forget it. You're just getting your hopes up and will be real dissappointed when the trade never happens

Everybody knows the NFL has a salary cap right????? Peppers is not coming.

Wish I had a buck for every Pats blog entry that contains the phrase "the feeling here is" or "my hunch is." What does "the feeling here" even mean? Whose feeling? Bottom line - most fans don't care about anything other than what the Pats are thinking or what someone with some credibility in the league thinks. We want some inside info on what's going on with the Pats and in the league, not just idle speculation.

As Mike pointed out earlier today, we're right up against the cap. Trading Watson wouldn't free up enough cap room. Peppers wants a big payday, and we're not going to give it to him, we can't afford to.

I do see Watson as being the obvious trade chip here though. The other possibility is one of the extra 2nd rounders we picked up for next year. I do think that the combination of Taylor going back to Miami alongside McKenzie's injury does leave us still a bit short in the LB/pass rush department. Trust in Bill though. He has a plan. He always has a plan!

Patrick -- I appreciate your enthusiasm mann but if I had to come up with and over under number, a platoon of Woods, Banta-Cain, Crable, Redd and Seau might net you 5 sacks all season and Seau would have at least 4 of them. The Pats should look at Colvin and McGinest unless someone else becomes available. It's not that I want a big name necessarily, I just want a proven pass rusher. Even Jarvis Green had an awful season last year. The lack of pass rush badly exposed our sub par secondary last year and cost us the super bowl in 07. Finally, just because we will lack a pass rush doesn't mean that we won't win the division quite easily. If we want to go deep into the playoffs, we will need to acquire a couple of guys that can get after the qb.
I'm sure Crable is a fine young player but I just can't see him going through an NFL season with his spindly, Marcus Camby legs; otherwise, he has all the tools.

The Mike Vrabel question REALLY isn't going to go away anytime soon now, is it?

If the Pats have a 20th-something (or even 30th-something) ranked pass rush next year behind Shawn Crable, Pierre Woods, and Tully Banta-Cain, everyone will STILL be second guessing whether or not Bill Belichick made a HUGE mistake and lapse of judgment on that one. After all, Julius Peppers and Jason Taylor are NOT coming through that door people, and while Crable, Woods, and Banta-Cain COULD rise to the occasion, they are very unproven and prove to as weak as the Pats unproven secondary last season.

What this means....

What this means is that a 3-4 based new england will be lining up in a 4-3 more often than normal. I wouldn't panic about losing out on a guy who'd be good on third down but wouldnt really be a part of the team. His heart isnt in football anymore and he is not the JT of old. Would it have been nice to get JT? Yeah, but the pats can manage without him. Lets put all those dts to work and lets have a little faith in tully (who was good with n.e but not sf) and a little faith in crable/woulds etc etc and a little faith in bill. Pats are gonna kill it this year

Mr Reez - DO the dopfins play in indy this year?

Other fallout from the Taylor signing is that Brady now has another "rush specialist" gunning for him in the division. Taylor may not be the dominate player he once was, but the talent in the east continues to improve.

Veeve

If Crable's legs are such a liability, how was he able to play football at
a major school like Michigan?

I like the chances of some of the younger guys contributing to the team.
I don't like the idea of recycling older guys again and again.

My sleeper in this mix is Redd. He is big enough and fast.

Wow with some of those names you are throwing out there, NE may set the record for fewest sacks in a season LOL!

Also is it "re-signing" with the Dolphins if he played for Washington last year? Wow we get JT back, and use the second round pick this year we got for him. Not to mention the cap friendly deal. Tuna you really are a genius.

Also is it "re-signing" with the Dolphins if he played for Washington last year? Wow we get JT back, and use the second round pick this year we got for him. Not to mention the cap friendly deal. Tuna you really are a genius.

Bring back Big Game Willie.

Christian says:

trade Watson and pick for Peppers and get it over with .............

Christian, it's going to take a whole lot more than just that to secure Peppers. Carolina has already turned down a first, so you have to do better. Add to that the fact that Watson has very little trade value right now, and you're still looking at at least one first rounder and probably a second rounder plus Watson. Then you still have to sign him to the ridiculous deal he is demanding, all to play a position he's never even played in the NFL before.

Not gonna happen.

Taylor is a wimp. We don't need baby arms like taylor who are going to whine about his family. I hope he enjoys his upcoming 6-10 season with the fins.

Well you get what u pay for. The Patriots play a form of cat and mouse with their players. At times daring them to walk for more money. Now its getting ready to bite them in the Ash. Options Lets see. They won't pay Peppers because this would disrupt the team chemistry. They probably will allow Seymour or Wilfolk to walk because like I said they don't want to pay talent that is deteriorating in Seymours case. Wilfolk is good but if Brace shows he is capable of playing the nose he becomes expendable. Finally, Bill wanted a 6'5 or bigger outside linebacker and when the kid from Tennessee and Cushing came off the board Bill was done with needs and drafted on value. I'm just a little confused that he didn't think the guy from Florida State was worth the 47th pick. Some draft gurus had him going as low 10 to SF or even Buffalo

Derrick Brooks is a free agent. We need experienced bodies and this guy was one of the best ever. Why is there no mention of the Pats possibly signing him. Is it because he so associated with the Tampa Two defense that he doesn't warrant consideration? Line this guy up ANYWHERE he's a football player. Brooks reads defenses better than 99 percent of the linebackers in the league. Maybe he is afraid of the cold too like Jason "Spray Tan" Taylor?

Y'all are commenting like Belichick was counting on Taylor becoming a Patriot - his bromance with T.B. being a factor. I would bet Belichick wasn't. Taylor isn't doing it because he loves the game but for other reasons. I'm glad he signed with the Dolphins because I don't think he'll last the year at playing prime ball.

Belichick has a plan and has known for a long time last years defense wasn't up to specs. Just because he hasn't told us his plans doesn't mean he doesn't know who's going to play OLB. He's got a plan on who the back-up is going to be too.

The Pats had some very good prospects to help their front seven in the draft, who lasted longer than I thought: Jarron Gilbert of San Jose St. , Michael Johnson of Georgia Tech, and Connor Barwin of Cincinnati. They should have picked up at least one of these big, tough, mobile guys in the second or third round. Unless Peppers is a surprise move, and I agree it isn't likely, then I think we are going to be sorry they did not strengthen the OLB, DE positions for the pass rush. They did great at strengthening the DB's through free agency and the draft but surprisingly did very little for the pass rush. It is a very complete team except for that weakness.

Bring in Junior Seau for depth at MLB and then sign Lawrence Taylor and Andre Tippett to platoon at OLB. Championship.

I think Big Game Willie Clay - oh wait, that was Big Play Willie Clay - now there is a blast from the past.

I don't know what's going on...just do what you have to do to get Peppers. The guy has proven that he can make it happen. If we weren't interested in a pick in the 1st round this year, why didn't we just give it to Carolina along with a no-name player and get it over with.

With him on the team...I can see the confetti now...

And now for the Celtics to find a way to lose, the Yankees to do well, and for each and everyone of you northeastern cheatin twatwaffles to get really pissed and beat your wives like they deserve it. hi5. tom brady will be shell of his lucky former self

mike - where does rosie colvin fit into all this? haven't heard his name for a while, when healthy he was a great olb for us, and was decent (albeit rusty) when he came back last season...

This team won 11 games last year WITHOUT Tom Friggn Brady and some of you nitwits are displaying your considerable lack of football knowledge in crying about one OLB position not having an all-pro lining up there. Wake up people!! Pats won 11 games last year and barely missed the playoffs; take a look at the roster compared to last year: QB - UPGRADE, RB - UPGRADE, TE - UPGRADE, WRs - UPGRADE, DBs - UPGRADE, DL - SAME, OL - SAME, LBs - SAME. I label LBs as same quality as last year because we lost AD to injured reserve, now he's back, but Vrabel's gone; but Mayo-the-Stud is not a rookie anymore. Does anyone here REALLY think Vrabel was the key the Pats defense this year? Puhleeeeeeze.

First, I am a Patriots fan.
I want to remind everyone that the 'Just trust Bill' manta is not sound logic or strategic season game planning, when the team is struggling on defense.
We lost the SB - bad offensive planning and aging defense.
Two most important themes for a healthy 2009 SB run are #1.) Protect Brady #2.) Perfect the Run Game #3.) PASS RUSH + SECONDARY = DEFENSE
We may have shored up the secondary, but we are still missing in PASH RUSH as was CLEARLY evidenced in 2008.
D

The 4-3 doesn't solve the issue at OLB. In fact, I think it would make it worse. The Pats aren't going to be running a two-gap 4-3 as the base D. It just isn't happening. You can't put four defensive tackles (which is basically what Wilfork, Sey, Warren, Green, Brace, and Wright are...) on the field and expect to generate a pass rush. You need edge rushers to pull it off. 4-3 or 3-4, the same deficiency is there.

The Greatest.....you are either a raiders fan or a steelers fan that is still upset about the "tuck rule" game of 2001. All I can say is "get over it"....we won 3, how many did you win?

Guys!!! This team went 11-5 with a back up QB. The defense lost Rodney Harrison, Adalius Thomas, Tank Williams, AND Ty Warren for a few games and we still were one God-I-wish-Favre-the-Jets-and-Mangini-didn't-suck half of football away from going at least a games deep into the playoffs if not further. Why does everybody sound as if this team is in deep trouble? This is a GREAT team. We're getting BRADY back! We don't need Peppers. If Brady stays upright, we're going ALL the way! Unfinished business has been eating at these guys for a whole year. They're getting their leader back. Yeah, he's p###ywhipped as all hell, but he's still Tom Brady and you'd be that whipped too if you were married to GB. Edge rush, smedge rush! We're going all the way.

I freakin laughed my a55 off at this, priceless. L OH FREAKIN L.

Taylor is a wimp. We don't need baby arms like taylor who are going to whine about his family. I hope he enjoys his upcoming 6-10 season with the fins.

Posted by Bill Belichek May 13, 09 04:13 PM

That fat toad Parcells (the retirement man) should start a business with the other disgraceful NFL retirement hero Brett Favre' seeing as there will be a lot of baby boomers on the verge of retirement in the comming years maybe they can do commercials on how to retire, re-retire, and retire again...

Jason Taylor is a wash out don't frett about that signing - look at his record with Washington plus he's an Infant/Baby girly man who cries when he doesn't get what he wants -

as a tranplanted pat fan forever in charlotte,nc thought you should know what panther fans and pundits think of peppers down here. he disappears for games and most of his sacks come in bunches against weaker tackles and usually when cats have big leads. poison in lockerroom and very few qb hurries. cheching his stats and you see 7 games in 08 no tackles no sacks nada.

"Wish I had a buck for every Pats blog entry that contains the phrase "the feeling here is" or "my hunch is." What does "the feeling here" even mean? Whose feeling? Bottom line - most fans don't care about anything other than what the Pats are thinking or what someone with some credibility in the league thinks. We want some inside info on what's going on with the Pats and in the league, not just idle speculation.

Posted by bobsled21"

bobsled21, You're right, we should not be posting opinions on thsese blogs . . . wait, isn't that what you just did??

I feel sorry for Patriots fans, the football legacy will be smeared by Patriots stealing signals as Barry Bonds legacy for -------- use

More of a hybrid defense coming in '09 with Tank and Chung getting more playing time. Vrabel was great but when we got him no one expected what he was able to do. Maybe Woods and Crable can step up (Banta Cain? are you kidding). I'd like to see a trade but don't see Peppers coming. I do know we can't win Super Bowl without a pass rush.

Jason Taylor did the smart thing from a business perspective. He is a brand in S. FLA with alot of real estate and business opportunities. He wants to finish strong as a Dolphin because the "discount" he took is more than worth $ it in the long term.

Matt Cassel worked out pretty well at quarterback, didn't he? Sometimes players just need an opportunity to show what they can do. The Pats have plenty of candidates to fill the OLB position. Let's see what they can do and not get so caught up on getting a big name. In Bill we trust...

Pardon my ignorance, but what is so hard about believing that the world's best NFL coach can turn a no-name large athlete into someone who can wisk by some goons and tackle da man wit da ball?

I say turn a negative to a positive, switch Watson to OLB to allow his natural athleticism to shine!

It amazes me the lack of knowledge some fans have about football. Someone has Seau playing OLB, when he is a ILB. People want Peppers for Watson and a first. Hey, why not just get James Harrison, and Peppers for a few late round picks! C'Mon people. The Pats have very little cap room to trade/sign anyone, especially after they sign their draft picks. The team is as it will be for the year. They will be fine.

1. Vastly improved secondary will make the pass rush better. Curious if Mike or anyone else has looked at tape and timed Vrabel or any other pass rushers over last two years to see how long it took them to get to the QB, versus how quickly opposing QBs delivered the ball? My admittedly uninformed guess is that the 2007 secondary, with Samuels and Harrison all year, forced QBs to hold the ball a bit longer, which helped with the sack totals.
2. A pass rush is about a lot of things, including the ability to confuse the QB with schemes and to take away the QB's money option on third down, usually tight end. The schemes last year didn't seem to confuse anybody on third down, and Harrison was really the only DB who could get physical at the line with opposing TEs - and he was clearly at the end of his rope. If Tank Williams and Patrick Chung can reassert that tough play at the line of scrimmage, and the defense is healthy and versatile enough to offer some more exotic schemes on third down, life will be difficult for opposing QBs this year.
3. If Taylor is willing to sign for 1.5 million for one year -- about a NINTH of what Peppers is tagged for -- he can't have much gas left. He was very unimpressive in Washington when asked to play a different end position - hard to believe he'd make the switch to OLB very well.
3.

Jim Keddy --

Jim, in the Big Ten, the average LT is probably about 280 lbs and in the NFL the average LT is over 320 lbs. As a total homer of a Pats fan, nobody would be happier than me if Crable were a monster and notched up a dozen sacks this year. Shoot, I'd happily stand up on a soapbox on Boston Common with a sign around my neck claiming I was an idiot if Shawn Crable proved me wrong and had a breakout year. As for Vince Redd, I want to see if he's learned the position yet; that may be his biggest hurdle. Woods resembles nothing more than a serviceable backup to date.

Hey, Pats fans- it's just as well. It appears that Taylor is more interested in things outside of football.

Jason Taylor is the next Curtis Martin playing out the rest of his career without even sniffing a Super Bowl never mind playing in one. Lets see 37 tackles and 3 1/2 sacks in 13 games with the Skins last year,why would we want him? Jerod Mayo had 23 unassisted tackles in ONE game last year and even Seymour gets 3 1/2 sacks. The only way Taylor is getting to the Super Bowl is to buy a ticket its his loss not ours. Robert

Mattym , why do you call Taylor "a dope" for choosing to sign with Miami?

Now, I dispise the 'phins just as much as the next die-hard Pats fan, but in today's business of players simply "going for money" and the days of watching your favorite player finish out his career with one team, part of me applauds Taylor for choosing to go "back home", wrapping up his career where he actually made a name for himself.

Perhaps joining a "Super Bowl front-runner" like the Patriots doesn't always trump loyalty.

Having said that, I don't think Taylor would have been a dominating force on defense for us the way everyone thinks of him being for Miami all those years.

Look, all of you Crable doubters out there need to do some research here.. This isn't just a guy who has "Spindley Marcus Cambry Legs"... Do some reading and watch some video.. This is a guy with speed (albeit in College for Michigan) who has decent penetration skills as well... There's a few videos out there on Youtube.com to watch and plenty of information to read... I say give the kid a chance.... Vrabel was a nobody before BB utilized him in his Defense and you want to kick Crable to the curb without having seen him play in the NFL (because he has skinny legs? Does anyone even have a current snapshot of what his legs looks like? You'all do know they have "Strength Coaches" on every NFL team, right? If his legs were that big of a concern then they'd work on it...

BTW - I don't think Jason Taylor's legs are all that big either.... Maybe he sucks too!

"Guys!!! This team went 11-5 with a back up QB. The defense lost Rodney Harrison, Adalius Thomas, Tank Williams, AND Ty Warren for a few games and we still were one God-I-wish-Favre-the-Jets-and-Mangini-didn't-suck half of football away from going at least a games deep into the playoffs if not further. Why does everybody sound as if this team is in deep trouble?"

The Patriots lost two games to late marches down the field, and flat out couldn't stop three other offenses in blowouts (one of which there were able to later resolve).

Why not bring back Colvin? I understand injuries with Colvin might be an issue, yet he came back at the end of last year and played well for us. D. Brooks is also still out there, I mean unless they are bringing heat from our secondary we need to rush the QB better. I'm sure Bill has it figured out!

Colvin did not play well. He is not very good and never was, thats why Thomas was brought in. D Brooks played in a 43 defense and is old as hell why would you want a tedy bruschi with a learning curve? I think the pats pass rush will be fine. They utilized blitz packages last year with the safeties and with tank, chung, meriweather, sanders etc. I think there wil be enough athleticism on the field to mix up packages. OLB's are not the only players capable of sacking the qb. Thomas can fill that role and rotate fresh bodies on the other side. No problem and no more old veterans on this team. Lets keep it young, athletic and fresh. GO PATS

Can we please put Bruschi out to pasture once and for all. The guy just can't do it any more. He is a great all-time Pat but enough is enough. He can't fill, cover or take on blocks like a good ILB needs to. This is not a new revelation. This (poor performance) has been going on for 4-5 years now. In Bill I trust but this one boggles my mind.